Is the paternity system feminist?

52 Comments

So 'roughly' about 30% on avg of all paternity tests prove the said father of the child really isn't the dad. That makes for a good continent load of pretty liars.

What's even more messed up is the majority of the time, even after that's established, the cuckolded father still has to continue fathering the child all the way to 18...

In or out of marriage (through maintenance mostly), he'll be loosing his salary by the thousands paying for the child of the dude his girl cheated on him with.

The legal system most of the time won't care whether you found out a day after you signed his birth certificate or years after.

In short. Guilty as she may be, she still walks away scotch free with his money, with more of it on it's way.

The court's argument basically is "You shoulda checked before you signed the papers." (You, might have a bigger problem if you're living in France though).

True, In most countries it's perfectly allowed to demand a test before being ordered to sign. Although what reason has the non the wiser man have to doubt her?
He did have unprotected sex, she is his girl, plenty of the times he's even married and they have been trying for kids have they not? Isn't that the secondary goal?

They finally get the kid and one of the first things he has to ask her is 'Is it mine?'. How does that work out with the other 70% with honest wives? Where does the trust element go to then?

What I find absurd mostly is how the male has to argue as to why he should not take care of someone else's child when she's the one who blatantly lied through her teeth yet the state will favour with her first by default.

As it stands an estimate of at least over a million people are paying child support for someone else's baby annually world wide.

Circumstantially speaking; the girl may not really know who the dad is but sure as hell can't/doesn't wanna deal with this alone.
The real daddy clearly won't be up to the task.
She knows her law and can see she'll get more out of Mr. A than Mr. B, 'cause lets face it. Women/girls aren't doing these things out of stupidity.

Simple question. Is the legal system as far as this is concerned feminist favoured?

Totally, for the females, by the females. 12
No, There's a reason it works this way (explain). 7
There's middle ground (explain). 6
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Comments ( 52 )
  • pazzler
    10 years ago

    You seem to be missing the point. You also seem to blame women, despite not understanding the result of what you are presented with. Paternity tests are taken when people are unsure. Would the percentages be different if the tests weren't only taken by people who already suspect the answer?

    Also, do you have a source for your 30% assertion? I've seen 9% to 11% in most groups. I'll believe you if you say you live in a country which has three times as many bastards as everywhere else, but I would still like to see something more concrete about this very high rate of bastardy you all suffer from in the country where you live.

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    • valisque
      10 years ago

      excuse me but why in the hell would a woman not be to blame? If she's not sure then she has absolutely no reason to be pointing fingers at men she suspects claiming its them.

      But no. she'd rather lie and make his like a living hell paying for something he wasn't responsible for.
      They know what they're doing every minute of it and still decide to lead men on.

      Btw. In most of what I've seen, It's 30%. You're not providing any links either.

      Easy on the BS.

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    • Anonymous Post Author
      10 years ago

      Okay. For the sake of the point you raised. let's just say it's 9%. That's still a lot of people annually.

      You may take note that I have made it clear that the figure's are not 100% accurate but more or less around that figure.

      How ever if you're looking for links then

      http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2002-12-02-paternity-usat_x.htm
      The Blood Banks confirmed.

      Is a start. That's from as early as the early 21st century.

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      • pazzler
        10 years ago

        That figure of around 10% has been standard for thousands of years and is pretty standard in other primate groups. It's just what we are.

        Alternatively, if men suppress some natural instincts because modern society suggests they should, maybe this is something that doesn't need to be part of female behaviour as we approach equality.

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        • valisque
          10 years ago

          lmfao so you have people who were able to give you dna evidence thousands of years back?? Show me that source

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          • Gallieon
            10 years ago

            Do notify me when she responds. I would also like to have a laugh.

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            • dom180
              10 years ago

              The frequency of cuckoldry does not necessarily require DNA testing to estimate.

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  • Freedom_
    10 years ago

    I agree with dom. It's wrong but it's not feminism. As for the U.S. it's simply the government being cheap, greedy and lazy.

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  • dom180
    10 years ago

    Stop equating feminism with anything that is bad for some people who are men. I'm pretty sure the vast majority of feminists do not want a system that blatantly scams men.

    If a person has to pay money to support a child that was not theirs, that is wrong. It sounds extremely unlikely to me that the law would be so unfair as to disagree with that.

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    • EccentricWeird
      10 years ago

      But that's what feminism IS.

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      • dom180
        10 years ago

        http://lmgtfy.com/?q=define+feminism

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        • EccentricWeird
          10 years ago

          It's a question of do as I say not as I do!

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    • Couman
      10 years ago

      It's a nonstandard usage, but at least it makes more sense then using the word feminism to refer to gender equality. I mean it's right there in the name, FEMinism, FEMale, it's not about equality.

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      • dom180
        10 years ago

        Just because it's got "fem" in the name doesn't mean it isn't about equality. If your argument is supported by only three letters, then you've got a very shallow argument.

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        • Couman
          10 years ago

          Soooo, wait. You're claiming the "fem" feminism means something else? It's just a coincidence that the name sounds like it refers to the same group of people who predominantly subscribe to the ideology and whose interests it serves?

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          • dom180
            10 years ago

            Not a coincidence, but it might as well be for all the importance it has.

            Feminism was created many years ago when gender equality was more black and white. Men had more rights than women in pretty much all cases. Calling an gender equality ideology "feminism" would make sense in that time seeing as females had less rights across the board.

            Now it's a left over term applied in the same way but to a wider group of people seeing as the scales are less unfairly balanced. As I see it, women still have a worse condition than men but it's more clear that men have an unacceptable condition in some areas too. Feminism serves men's interests in areas where men have an unacceptable condition. It's happening right now in this thread: I am a feminist, and I am defending men's rights right here.

            I think you're putting too much importance on the word. It's just a word. Which letters appear in a word don't define the word's meaning.

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            • Couman
              10 years ago

              I knew we're way off topic now but... At best it's kind of ironic though isn't it? Many feminists seem to agree language and word choice are pretty important.

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        • Anonymous Post Author
          10 years ago

          I think we both know his argument has a lot more ground than just 3 letters. Associating it with equality really may not have started off the way its publicized but it's largely been dubbed and accepted as nothing more than a formality by both genders, unofficial as it may be.

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          • dom180
            10 years ago

            I really disagree. I am a feminist, and I believe in equality. I know a lot of feminists personally, and every single one of them believes in equality. I'm sure there are feminists who do not believe in equality, but that isn't enough to debunk the fact that any academically rigorous flavour of feminism has equality as part of its ideological core.

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            • YourMomSaysHello
              10 years ago

              Where are you feminists when society is being unfair to men? Where are you militants and activists when the government treats men as disposable tools and sperm donors? When something bad happens to women you manifest on the street or in the court, signing petitions and walking around with banners victimizing yourself. If you claim you're all for equality, why don't you get out on the street when injustice is being done to men? Because you don't want equality. You want privilege and supremacy. You fucking hypocrites!

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    • Jim_Sochs
      10 years ago

      Some non-bio "fathers" are liable for support if it is found that they acted as a father to the child for a long enough period of time, the child knows the man as his or her father, and if taking away the support and presence of the "father" would be detrimental to the child.

      In support cases, an assessment is generally done prior to ordering DNA testing to determine if the court can just assign paternity based on the critwria I described above.

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      • dom180
        10 years ago

        I think, in that case, it's more reasonable expect the father to pay child support even if he isn't biologically linked to the child. Especially if the mother didn't know the identity of the biological father until the test. The man is the father in all but biology, and I don't think biology is all that important in what makes someone the father. In that case, perhaps a system by which child support was split between the biological and non-biological father would be fairest.

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        • Jim_Sochs
          10 years ago

          I agree that the reasoning behind him being liable is sound, to a point.

          This should not be happening to unwitting men anymore though and women need to be held accountable when they defraud men. Men, before signing the birth certificate, should be informed of their right to DNA testing and versed in these support laws. Men should have that courtesy!! Women should be held accountable for not disclosing the possibility of other fathers when filling out the birth certificate. Knowingly inputting false or incomplete information on the birth certificate application should be a crime taken seriously.

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          • dom180
            10 years ago

            I agree that a paternity test should be default, and the birth certificate should be signed by the biological father after his identity is confirmed.

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        • Mazlow
          10 years ago

          Okay I'm calling bullsh%t here. Not your kid, not your responsibility.

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          • dom180
            10 years ago

            If you act as that kid's father for 15 years and the kid loves you as his or her father, I believe that makes you more the father than some stranger who had sex with the mother 15 years and 9 months ago. By that point, it *is* your kid.

            I still think the biological father should have some responsibility. That's why I said there should be a split. It could even be a 60/40 or 70/30 split. I've not thought that deeply into it.

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      • Jim_Sochs
        10 years ago

        *criteria

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    • Anonymous Post Author
      10 years ago

      Apparently it is. It's not an outright law as such but it is how the judicial system has always worked though.

      And it's a poll. I didn't equate it to feminism. I just asked for the opinion whether it was or not.

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  • [Old Memory]
    10 years ago

    I don't think this is "feminism", just the legal systems bias that complies with giving men the raw end of the stick.

    I think that paternity tests should be mandatory. That way a man doesn't have to fear a large fallout for assuming dishonesty for his sake, while the ones that are right to assume can get the answers.

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    • dom180
      10 years ago

      Paternity testing should be part of the process by default. It's cheap, non-invasive and important in a society where we value a child's right to be certain of the identity of their biological parents. At the very least an opt-out system rather than opt-in.

      We agree on something! Not often that happens, especially when words like "feminism" get thrown around.

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      • [Old Memory]
        10 years ago

        It shall forever be put in stone that this day is where we agreed on something involving feminism. With times like these, a new Messiah wouldn't nearly be a miracle. Lol.

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    • Jim_Sochs
      10 years ago

      It's not biased against men, it's centered on the best interest of children. This can often cause perceived injustice for both men and women.

      I completely agree that paternity testing should be routine and on an opt-out rather than opt-in basis. However, many men will still end up on the hook for non-bio children if they opt to stick around knowing the child isn't theirs. At least it will be an informed choice though.

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      • RoseIsabella
        10 years ago

        If I were a man I sure as hell wouldn't stick around for a baby that wasn't mine.

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    • RoseIsabella
      10 years ago

      I also don't agree with most of what you usually have to say about feminism and women in general but I WHOLEHEARTEDLY AGREE 100% with what you're saying here about mandatory paternity testing! I don't think anyone in their right mind would disagree unless they were a two timing, gold digging whore. I can't stand opportunistic women like that; they're human garbage.

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  • as91
    10 years ago

    taking money when she knows there is a chance that he isn't the father should be considered a robbery and she should be arrested for it and forced to pay it all back. Regardless of if he signed the birth certificate or not. I don't care if a girl wants to sleep around but to pin a kid on a man when she knows it may not be his is skank behavior.

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  • Mazlow
    10 years ago

    OKAY. LETS LAY THE RECORD STRAIGHT.

    Feminism is only "equal" when it's to females advantage! You will never find a female how ever going out there waving banners and signs when an instance such as the OPs post happens.

    In fact, you will never find feminists going out and protesting against any unfair legal act that benefits their gender.

    So... For the sake of not misleading anyone. Lets use the term "gender equality" *very* sparingly here.

    "Equality".. such BS.

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    • dom180
      10 years ago

      I think relying purely on feminist activism to explain what feminism is is what is misleading.

      It's like explaining what gravity is by saying "it's what makes apples fall to the Earth". If you know about the theory behind gravity you know it is a lot more than just what it looks like on the surface. Feminism is like that. If you just rely on base level observations about what activists do you're never going to get the full picture.

      To use a more comparable example: it's like saying anyone who is anti-immigration is white supremacist. Just because some campaigners show signs of supporting white supremacy doesn't mean anti-immigration = white supremacy. In the same way: some feminist campaigners may appear to be female supremacists, but that doesn't mean feminism = female supremacy.

      You can't look at banner-wavers and say "this is all that feminism is, this is all that feminists stand for". What you're doing is seeing the extremists, and defining a term by the the term's extreme rather than its average. You have to read about a word to understand what it *really* means, not just look at people who use the word and try and haphazardly cobble together some assumptions.

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  • McCuckold
    6 years ago

    Men should be submissive to the women who let us make love to them, and who bear our children. If your wife enjoyed another man, and he impregnated her, consider yourself lucky. I would be so aroused at the thught of my wife enjoying another man, that I would be proud to raise their child and devote myself to Her. Stop complaining and realize you belong to her... Even if she chooses to be with other men sometimes.

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  • Jim_Sochs
    10 years ago

    No, it's "childist". The family court system puts children first. That can lead to perceived unfairness for both men and women.

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    • YourMomSaysHello
      10 years ago

      Really now? REALLY? Puts children first? Go slam your head against the pavement!

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      • Jim_Sochs
        10 years ago

        I didn't say it was a perfect system or that no bad decisions are made. Simply, the laws are pro-child.

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    • EccentricWeird
      10 years ago

      People who invent new "ist" words should shampoo a donkey.

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      • Jim_Sochs
        10 years ago

        As per your request, I have washed my ass.

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    • Mazlow
      10 years ago

      Okay lets not even begin to lie to ourselves. This whole 'its about the children' BS is just getting way overused. Let the effing grownups responsible for the whole mess account for the ish they're doing like in the rest of the legal system.

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