Ask Your Question today
My thought process is this: Why should someone who is not paying into the tax base, not contributing to the economy or having a career. If you disagree, mention why in the comments. If you are negative towards me in the comments, they will be removed?
Why not go all the way and return to a system where only white men over 21 who hold a clear title to real estate above a certain value are allowed to vote?
And what does this mean:
"If you are negative towards me in the comments, they will be removed?"
So you want comments, but will only accept those that validate your opinions?
You can block people whose comments trigger you, and that will mean that you can't see the responses, but others will still see them. They'll also see that you didn't address the points they made and they may well assume you were too butt-hurt to reply.
-Maybe they lost their job because the policies of the current administration created an atmosphere that caused their jobs to be moved overseas.
-What if they won the lottery and said "Fuck it, I ain't working no more."
-They're still paying taxes in other ways so why should they be taxed without representation?
“If you are negative towards me in the comments, they will be removed?“
My opinion, people who don’t understand the usage of question marks should not be allowed to vote.
So if a woman is a stay at home parent you don’t think she should have the right to vote. That makes you a sexist moron, I know there are some stay home fathers these days but they are still few and far between compared to women. Then there is the poor unfortunate who looses their job through no fault of their own, but you think they shouldn’t vote despite the fact they may have worked for years paid their taxes and lived an honest life and are desperately trying to get another job. Then what about the elderly who worked all their life and are now living out a well deserved retirement, so you are ageist as well as a sexist pig.
No, she has the right to a citizen vote but the guy (or girl) who goes out every day to work for 10 hours or so should get a second vote. There has to stop the way the West is going that the freeloaders seem to get more of the say.
That is the most ridiculous thing I ever heard. To say everyone can vote but working people get an extra vote is exactly the same as giving one vote to people who work and no votes to people who don’t have a job. Therefore my original answer stands
No it doesn't, that theory only works in countries such as Switzerland where voting is compulsory and every election has 100% turnout. The average turnout in the UK is closer to 50%.
Making voting compulsory is a completely different argument and I can think of arguments for and against that system. But the OP is saying he believes only people who work should vote. As previously stated this is discrimination on multiple levels due to the number of reasons people are not working. What he is actually proposing is something very similar to how things were a couple of centuries ago when in order to vote you had to be male and own property. The criteria he suggests is different but the principle is the same. We as a society have spent decades fighting for equality for all, why would anyone want to undermine that?
Then there'll be a higher ratio of rich people to poor people with more voting power, and the wealth gap will increase. There's not enough poor people voting as it is due poor people often having to turn to crime and people with a criminal record not being allowed to vote. Plus because poor people have less educational opportunities and so aren't as educated about the importance of voting, and so don't bother voting.
My first thought is on dependents over 18 who don't need to work
My second is on the morality of the topic
On the same logic, people under 18 who cant vote shouldnt be taxed for their work. That would be taxation without representation.
Oh! Sorry forgot to ask, are you going to remove my post because it doesn’t fit with your hypocritical view of the world?
A big problem here is that paying taxes doesn't automatically mean that you are in the black with regards to the system, so it could be argued that in this situation a person isn't contributing. I don't live in the USA so I can't give you the exact numbers, but there will be a certain threshold of taxes that you need to pay in order to be covering your own costs. It will probably be quite high. There will be shitloads of people who are currently paying taxes who are still massively indebted to the system.
Basically what I'm saying is that it is usually only the relatively high earners who are actually contributing more than they take from the system. A lot of people like to sit around and say stuff about how their tax dollars have paid for XYZ, so they should be entitled to whatever, but in reality most of them haven't actually "paid" for anything.
So... do we exclude people who are on low incomes? Do we have a points system where you keep track of how much public money someone has "spent"? That would also mean that your right to vote would depend on where you lived, as different areas will have different costs with regards to street cleaning, rubbish collection, police costs etc.
I think it starts to get elitist and I don't support that.
Just because someone is unemployed, doesn't mean they're not contributing. Stay-at-home parents are a thing. Someone could also just be between jobs.
It's a free country. You're free to believe whatever you want, but other people are free to disagree with you! I'm completely fine with things how they are.
If we follow this twisted logic, that puts a money value on human life, do you think large tax payers like Bill Gates, Besos, Musk and Zuckerbergs shall be given each thousands or millions of votes?
Anyone able to make a conscious choice shall have the right to vote, including felons. Because in alleged free country each life shall matter. And if a life matters, it's voice shall too. Persons like George Floyd shall have the right to vote out politicians who back police brutality.
Agree on everything except for the fact that the super duper rich pay fuck all in taxes. They can afford tax sheltering & off shore accounts.
Ugh, could you imagine if we had a terrifyingly creepy government chosen by Zuckerberg? There'd be creepy listening devices in all of our houses & our brains would be blasted with targeted adds via earbud (sold separately ofc).
These devices are already there promoted as smart home system, ya know? Smart fridges, smart ovens and dishwashers. So they can monitor and control every aspect of yout daily life, if they wish so. You can control them from your smartphone - for fuck's sake?! Even if I could, I still have to manually load them with products/laundry etc.. And then couldn't I just use a plain old timer to have them start at desired given time?
But there's even worse.. Elon Musk has not given up on his brain-implanted chips program, just checked out, latest coverage from 8d ago..
And I totally agree they're not paying the due amount of taxes. An example was Zuckerberg 'donating' all his assets (as least so I recall it to have been reported a few years back) - to a foundation? Guess whose? 'Owned' by his own 1yo bastard. I bet charity entities' assets are exempt from taxes in the US. His openly evading the laws and even had the nerve to present it as some noble deed. 'Donating' - to himself. That's the sad reality and corrupt politicians like either Biden or Trump dindu won't do fuckin nuffin about it..
Republicans or Democrats doesn't matter, it's the illuminati pulling their strings from behind the curtain
If you haven't yet, read Aldous Huxely's Brave New World. It came out around the same time as 1984, everyone's favorite idea of what a government controlled society would look like, but it's way more relevant to our real world.
I've been aware of the allure of conspiracy-thought for decades, and I do my best not to get sucked down that bottomless rabbit hole.
However, I do find smart devices sinister, and I'd never buy a smart appliance. Cortana, Siri and their like disturb me. Those services are constantly active and listening, and it seems to me that anyone using them is essentially volunteering to be bugged. We don't have microphones connected to any of our PCs, and we never use any sort of voice-activated apps on our smartphones. And, yeah, I'm aware that there's all sorts of data being harvested from our browser use, and even the data from our electric meter (which is read remotely by our electricity supplier) will indicate things about how we live our lives. But as I say, I try not to be _too_ paranoid about this stuff.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2020/03/04/facebook-not-recording-our-calls-but-has-other-ways-snoop/4795519002/
I'm not a conspiracy believer either. The ability to even believe in government conspiracies means you've made the assumption that the government is competent, competent enough to pull off a conspiracy & competent enough to willfully keep it a secret. I simply don't believe the government is competent, period
I absolutely do think businesses are capable of this, though & they are constantly coming up with new models to garner access to information about consumers. Voice activated tech is only one way to give them access.
Unfortunately, people don't realize that their conversations, internet history, background & spending habits are an extremely, extremely valuable commodity to marketing researchers & they've been giving it away for free in the name of convenience.
Privacy of information is a thing of the past, and it will degrade even further, but people are GIVING it away & not because they have to, but because they WANT to.
There's an alliterative adage that (I think) only makes sense in British English: There are those who believe in the conspiracy theory of history, and those who believe in the cock-up theory of history.
(I don't think 'cock-up' is commonly used in American English, but it's not as rude as it might sound; it's synonymous with screw-up.)
Having seen so much human stupidity - often on the part of people who genuinely have the best of intentions - during my life, I'm firmly in the 'cock-up' camp. If people can screw things up they will, and the law of unintended consequences will bite almost everyone on the arse sooner or later. So, like you, I really don't have huge fears about governments in (nominally) democratic countries.
Businesses are something else, not least because they can afford to hire much better (or, more accurately, more fiendishly devious and smarter) people than those just about any government can afford. And human nature being what it is, the personal profit motive will always be much stronger than the desire to do what's best for the larger society you belong to.
There's conspiracy theory and then there are just facts. Conspiracy theory lumps actual facts and questions whose answers don't add up with people who think the earth is hollow and aliens built the pyramids. The world is run by the people who have all the money. There are people who are so rich they could buy entire countries, so the governments of these countries no longer matter. Inflation is a fee we all pay through the devaluing of our money for the use of Rothschilds imaginary currency system. Those aren't conspiracy theories they're just facts. If you do some reaserch its pretty easy to see how the NWO power structure is already in place and has been for decades.
Exactly. It's honestly nice to have. I'm on my smartphone right meow, but I'm not gonna pretend that doesn't mean I have an extensive Google profile...which is honestly full of pretty funny stuff.
I've googled "what do u call cat fingers"
Toes...the answer is toes.
They already put a money value on human life. Your birth cirtificate is a bank document that turns you into a commodity the country can use to leverage the skyrocketing national debt against. We're all collateral in those loans.
Yeah, I was unaware of that for a long time until my crazy ex pointed it out to me. I think I go more than my share of that stuff from him, but it's interesting I guess. He used to talk conspiracy theory stuff to anyone who would listen, and it was oftentimes embarrassing.
But I mean that isnt conspiracy theory... its a fact that exists in the public domain where you can look it up.
Conspiracy theory is stupid. The thing that bugs me is I was saying somewhere else in this topic one of the things I do for work is fix shortwave radios. I listen to that crap. People have told me that numbers stations are conspiracy theory stuff, but theyre a documented fact that people even know the reason for and there are openly availible tracked schedules and transcripts of their transmissions. That's not a conspiracy theory, its encoded spy transmissions sent over shortwave bands on set schedules that you can track and listen to for yourself.
I just dont like how anything questioning the status quo is labelled "conspiracy theory"
If you're talking about people who are actively looking for jobs, no, they should still be able to vote.
If you're talking about social welfare, I see where you're coming from, but there still are various reasons why some people are on it, etc. due to health reasons, outside circumstances, Disability, so the healthcare laws still affect them.
If you're talking about social welfare for ghettos, etc. I think hopefully there will be active change in the future from our governments to get these people out. It's the governments fault for putting them there in the first place so the people have no say to get out, gotta be some outside change etc.
I've thought through this issue several times in my life looking at a variety of ways to do it (employment/business owner, pay federal - local - state taxes (and various combinations of those), everyone, etc.
Every system has pro's and con's. Overall, I still think that the current system where everyone 18 or older can vote unless they are a convicted felon for violent and certain other crimes, or mentally incompetent.
The next best system in my opinion is that only people who served in the US Military or other government recognized service organization such as the Peace Corp, etc.
If you are not willing to serve your country - then you don't get a vote. It keeps the freeloaders from voting.
I doubt anything will change.
They still buy stuff. And there is a tax charged in everything that is bought.... But I respect your thoughts.
I disagree. Many people got unemployed without choice. If there is a large rate of unemployment that either way points to some sort of society problem that maybe could be solved with the right politics. Politics should be seen from all angles of society, the unemployed belongs too. The more we evaltuate "who should be allowed to vote" the more we risk undermining democracy
People shouldn’t be allowed to vote to destroy others’ livelihood or small business.
The easy way to stop the claimers union from running the country, any country, is to have one vote as a citizen and a second for paying income tax.
Won't happen, Democrats would cease to exist.
It couldn't happen simply the way you mentioned, it would have to account for those that want to work but can't. There would need to be a way of knowing if an unemployed person has legitimately tried to find work or at the very least tried to do volunteer work.
There are Republicans and Democrats who are both unemployed?? I have Vietnam veterans in my family and Marines. Who are still trying to find jobs etc. There are many different populations in the US who have various experiences.
Technically all you have to do to claim you're "looking for work" is apply to places that you know aren't going to hire you. Not sure how this would work when most of the country is out of work right now anyway. But honestly it doesn't matter cause votes dont even really count.
I'm sure there could be a method to counter that. The country I'm in have people who's jobs it is to find you a job, I don't know if the US has something similar but it would work wonders with this concept, assuming those employees actually do their job instead of just trying to run the clock like too many do here.