I don't agree with the idea of being too drunk to consent

It seems to be accepted now that if someone is extremely drunk, and then they have sex with someone, that that person apparently raped them because the drunk person couldn't possibly consent to sex in that state. I don't agree with this though. By saying that you can't consent when you're that drunk is basically saying that you can be too drunk to be responsible for your decisions and actions, and that that responsibility should fall on someone else instead. But if that's the case, then you could use the excuse of being too drunk to get away with anything.

Someone could argue that they shouldn't be arrested for assaulting someone, because they couldn't be held responsible for their actions in that state, since they were too drunk at the time to be fully aware of the situation and to consciously make that decision. And they could then argue that it's their friends who should be arrested for it instead, since they were the sober ones, yet they didn't do anything to stop it because they were enjoying watching it.

But of course that would be a ridiculous excuse. This person decided to get that drunk in the first place, and they're responsible for their own actions regardless of how drunk they were. They can't try to pass the blame onto someone else, their own actions aren't anyone else's responsibility. And this is regardless of the situation, whether it's deciding to assault someone or to have sex with someone. Yet people seem to have a double-standard when it comes to sex.

Obviously I'm not saying that it's ok to seek out drunk people to have sex with, and then to have sex with them, fully knowing that they'll regret it the next day. That's obviously disgusting behaviour (likewise letting your drunk friend assault someone because you'd enjoy watching a fight is also disgusting). But it's not rape.

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  • I literally seen people dragged away drunk and people try to forcibly make out with. These people where very drunk and probably too drunk to physically fight them off. I also seen people take advantage of drunk people by trying to rob and steal their money. Just because you are a predator who sees an easy mark doesn't mean it's a good thing to do. People like you need to be hung on a tree so rapists get the message. We need to go back to public executions. Some of you sick bastards taking advantage of others restraint. I also intervened between these nearly raped drunk people on multiple occasions.

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    • I literally said in my post that it'd be disgusting to take advantage of a drunk person, I don't know how you think that I would do something like that. What you're describing is even worse though, I would absolutely deem that as rape. Forcibly making out with anyone, whether they're drunk or not, is sexual assault. And if they then forcibly have sex with them as well, then it's undoubtedly rape.

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  • You people are such fucking losers it’s insane. The social and emotional retardation on this website reeks so bad sometimes.
    The only thing that gives me peace of mind is knowing that you’re such an outcasted freak you wouldn’t be invited anywhere anyway and are probably too agoraphobic to leave your house to begin with.

    Who wrote this ?

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    • I did. There's nothing in your comment to counter anything I said though. If what I wrote was so wrong, then you should be able to give multiple reasons why. You're insulting me instead because that's the only possible response you can think of.

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  • waste of space

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  • Then you're a rapist lover. Gross.

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  • Mostly, it is a out the other sober person taking advantage of the drunk person.
    For example, say a sober person encouraged or forced someone drunk to drive, that would be the sober person's fault, right? Same with sex. If you are not in your right mind, and someone forces you to do anything, it is not your fault.

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    • Actually yes. Legally all the responsibility would fall on the drunk person who got behind the wheel despite him being purposefully set up.

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    • Well if someone forces you to do something, then it is entirely their fault, regardless of whether you're drunk or not. If someone forces you to have sex with them then it's rape, it doesn't matter whether you've been drinking or not.

      However if someone merely takes advantage of the fact that you'd be more willing to have sex with them of your own free will when you're drunk, then it's not rape (assuming they didn't spike your drink, that you chose to get drunk). It's just very scummy. And someone pressuring you into having sex with them, regardless of whether you're drunk or not, again isn't rape, it's just very scummy. You're choosing to have sex with them in both of these scenarios, so it can't be called rape.

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      • You got down voted but what you say is true. If they willingly have sex with you thats their decision they made. Its a scummy thing to do but its simply not rape. If thats rape than almost ANY one night stand that ever happened was rape.

        That would also mean i have been raped on multiple occasions.

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        • Thank you. Yeah it's very telling when people downvote you but can't refute you, it's like they just cover their ears to things they don't want to hear. And that's true too about one night stands, which is why this whole idea of drunk sex equating to rape is just stupid.

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  • I'm fine with the idea that having sex with an intoxicated person is rape, but I fucking can't stand the double standard that if a sober woman sexes up a drunk man, it's not rape, but if a sober man sexes up a drunk woman or a drunk man sexes up a drunk woman then it's rape regardless of how into it she was

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    • That's true, there is a double standard there alright. If the following morning, the guy regretted sleeping with the woman, then people would think he's a jerk. They'd say that he just used her and now he wants to be rid of her because she's not attractive enough.

      Or if the man and woman are equally drunk that night, then the responsibility for calling it off always seems to fall on the man.

      And I'd bet that most people would still be far more willing to believe that the woman was raped by the man, rather than the other way around, even if she was perfectly sober while he was barely functional.

      I don't blame women for all these double standards though, I blame society in general. And I'm not trying to turn this into a 'men vs. women' debate, obviously there are plenty of double standards against women too, probably more than against men. But still things like this need to be talked about as well.

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  • Its not a black and white issue.
    I see both sides. Ive personally witnessed women use it as an excuse before and also to try to place blame on a guy that she regrets sleeping with later. On one occassion at this house party when I was younger there was this preppy girl who my friend (a known hellraiser) was hitting on. They were both drinking but neither was really that drunk. Long story short he fucked her. Then news got around town and her circle of prudes started saying that she was a whore for sleeping with the guy. Then she came out with the "I was too drunk, I dont remember, he forced himself on me." Which was an outright lie.

    She was fully coherent and she was flirting back and she made her decision.This can be dangerous because women can weaponize this. Also if for example a guy ghost her after fucking a girl she can use this card to get police involved. And this shit happens all the time. No one talks about it.

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    • I don't know why people get involved in the first place. Usually low life wimps that think everybody wants to rape them.
      I once briefly started crushing on this guy at work. He's gone now RIP. Anyway, as soon as he first put his hand on my private area, people saw. The next day all these little wimps were like, "oh, he did that to you and you didn't say anything to HR so I'm telling HR"
      As If u gotta tell your employer every time you 2nd base with someone
      I was like, "bitch, girl likes boy, they end up touching each other"

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      • Yeah its like we are programmed to right away get offended when someone makes a move

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  • Long story short if 2 people willingly agree to have sex, it's not rape. It's only rape if someone is forcing or otherwise co-ercing someone to have sex when they don't want to. That's the definition of rape and that's all.

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    • I've seen worse. I found out an aquintance of mine was a rapist just by the way he was talking. I was like, "ok man, I'm getting out of your house" as I try to make it to the front door, I'm trying to block him out and I'm like "no no no". HE WAS FOLLOWING ME THE WHOLE TIME! I ended up losing my defenses and end up "uh uh uh", what I didn't know was that he had the cops on the line and HE said that I raped him, me. We don't even talk like we're intimate. The cops fell for it because as soon as they mentioned sex I started laughing.. no shit.
      Anyway, the cops ended up taking his side, and I know the only reason why they took his side is because he could manipulate people , I can't and I'm glad that I ain't like that.
      But I don't care much because I know what's true

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      • Are you a woman? Because why would they believe a woman raped a man? Women have vaginas and are physically weaker than men

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  • Honestly gotta agree with you. I know full well what im like when I drink. Havr I done things that I've regretted? Hell yea but I was never once raped I said yes and I meant it. Regret isn't rape. No is rape yes is consent plain n simple

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  • Driving even slightly drunk is dangerous and irresponsible. The slightest lapse in judgement can get you or someone else either injured or killed.

    As far as sex goes, I’d say it depends on how drunk the person is. If they drink enough to loosen up but are still capable of making their own decisions about whether they want to have sex, then go for it.

    If they are clearly wasted, and they are stumbling around and slurring their words, absolutely not. They are beyond the point of rational thought and it is definitely not ok to approach them for sex. And if they are the ones coming onto you, say no. They aren’t thinking straight, and they will definitely regret it in the morning. And will possibly hate you for life.

    And if they are so drunk they pass out and your intentions are anything other than trying wake them up or make them more comfortable while they sleep it off, you’re an asshole who should never be trusted around women.

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    • I agree with most of what you say, I'm not trying to defend taking advantage of drunk people, I just don't consider it rape (although it is really despicable).

      That's true that someone who's just a little tipsy would be fully capable of making their own decisions, including the decision to have sex or drive. But if they drive while even a little tipsy, that is still enough for them to kill someone, and so they should be arrested alright.

      However if you say that someone who's really drunk isn't capable of making the decision to have sex (and that therefore if someone has sex with them then they should be charged with rape), then the same should be true for any other decision, including driving.

      If the person was completely drunk (rather than just a little tipsy), then that'd mean they were incapable of making the decision to drive in the first place. Therefore if they were caught drink driving, then arguably they shouldn't be arrested for it, because they couldn't have possibly consented to the act in that state. Of course this argument is ridiculous, they should be held responsible and face the consequences. But then why is the same not true for the decision to have sex with someone? It's a double-standard, and just such a glaring flaw that I've found in this argument about drinking and consent.

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  • It isn't a black and white issue. But it isn't that grey either. If you can't defend yourself, or even speak for yourself because you are too drunk, it's rape. It is not the same an walking into traffic while drunk. Do some people abuse this? Yes, but that's the price of having a penis. If you don't want to get fucked, be respectful.

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  • If you dont want to get raped, then just avoid drunk people, and parties/occasions where there is lot of drinking. Its that simple. Or we can just ban alcohol too.

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  • The are many differences in your examples.
    One: who the aggravator is
    Two: if you're less drunk than the other individual
    Three: if a drunk person is throwing themselves at you sexually, you can decline. It isn't the same as someone being drunk and attacking you, which you cant decline.

    So, I 100% think someone can be too drunk to consent.

    perfect example:
    There have been many times where people have been hammered and thrown themselves at me and I've declined because I was sober or much more sober than they were and i could tell they wouldn't remember( not consent) and I would. They would possibly regret it ( not making sound choices, also not consent), so to me, that's nonconsensual sex. The amount of people that dont see that and dont think " I shouldn't do this" astounds me.

    Plus, there are the many many examples of the one person being so drunk they can barely speak and someone taking them home to fuck them even when they say "no,no" in a drunken stammer.

    Some people are so fucking desperate they'll take a drunk consent as consent. I dont move forward with an action unless I know I am getting an enthusiastic yes.

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    • Well I chose that example because I wanted to show how the same excuse of being too drunk to consent could be used as an argument to get away with doing something really bad.

      In your example, if you did have sex with that drunken person, even knowing that they may not remember or would regret it, then I still wouldn't regard that as rape. I'm not defending it though. It would still be disgusting alright, and it astounds me as well that many people would go through with this. But I still couldn't call it rape.

      Well "No" means "No". It doesn't matter if they say it in a drunken stammer or not. Pretending you didn't hear it or not taking it seriously because it was barely comprehensible isn't good enough. It's still rape if the person still has sex with them after they said "No".

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  • Yeah yeah, when you're drunk your defenses are down so it only shows your true colors.... and all that bullshit people fall for.
    On that note, I only get drunk at home

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  • You can't make decisions when drunk... you lose control and you can't think properly... Maybe you think drunk people should be allowed to drive too huh since they make such well thought decisions... It's definietely rape when one can barely walk in a straight line because they're so out of it.. It's the same as children not being able to consent because they can't think properly either and understand consequences.

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    • I think the key here is responsibility vs consent. You can't consent drunk. If drunk you decides drive you still get DUI. Pretending a drunk person can reasonably consent means you are a rapist. Also a lot of people think drunk person not fighting back is consent. This is a barely functional person I not sure how that equals consenting to rape.

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    • "You can't make decisions when drunk". But with that logic, if I murder someone when drunk then I shouldn't be held accountable for my actions and so I should be let go.

      No I don't think people should be allowed to drive drunk. That's a bad comparison though, nobody dies if a drunk person has very bad sex. But if someone makes the decision to drive drunk then I do think they should be prosecuted for it. They shouldn't be let go because they argue that they couldn't possibly have made an informed decision to drive. They're responsible for that drunken decision, same with someone who decides to have sex drunk.

      When someone gets drunk, they decide to do so, fully knowing the risks of making stupid decisions when drunk. Children have no such choice, so that's not a good comparison either.

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      • The only idiot who agree with drunk driving is you retard. It's consent vs responsibility. If you choose to get drunk drunk than drive you are responsible for the results. If however you are drunk and someone sees a free pass you can not consent. There is a difference between consent vs responsibility. A child can be responsible for graffitying the wall. However saying that they can consent to sex with an adult is still no even if that pedophile wants the consent to be there.

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        • What are you talking about? I just said "No I don't think people should be allowed to drive drunk" and that "if someone makes the decision to drive drunk then I do think they should be prosecuted for it". You call me an idiot but you're the one who seems unable to read.

          I don't think there is a difference between consent and responsibility. People just treat sex differently from every other decision that someone could make when drunk, because they still view sex as a sensitive subject because of some lingering societal sexual repression. It should be treated equally to any other decision made when drunk.

          Well ultimately, the resonsibility for a child graffitying a wall falls on the parents. They have to pay for the damages. Besides, children understand what they're doing when they graffiti a wall, they don't fully understand sex yet though. So they can consent to graffitying, but can't consent to sex.

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