Western feminism makes no sense to me

Western feminists claim they fight for the equal rights of men and women, but want women to have special privileges over men, which is not equality at all. They also want to have open borders so we can let in thousands of men from countries where women are treated as second-class citizens, which makes absolutely no sense to me. So in a nutshell, western feminists want privileges, but get more oppression instead, which is absolutely laughable.

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Based on 75 votes (49 yes)
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Comments ( 53 )
  • Protagoras

    Just reading the comments as well as the original post is the epitome of all this alt-right incel lunacy on the internet. Why not just go talk to actual feminists and see what they're really about instead of sitting in echo chambers using straw man arguments to make yourself feel better? MRA/MGTOWs whine about how men suffer higher suicide rates, but when feminists bring up toxic masculinity (men being shamed for things like crying) and patriarchy (holding norms for men not being allowed to show emotion) you guys throw a hissy fit.

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    • bigbudchonga

      Lol, anyone who disagrees with feminism isn't "alt-right" or an "incel," this is one of the reasons people don't like feminists. They're often very dishonest, and everyone who disagrees with them is immediately a misogynist or alt-right.

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      • factcheck

        Give me an example of one person who "disagrees with feminism" that isn't alt-right. They don't exist. You can claim you're not alt-right, but if you disagree with feminism, it's a near certainly that you share the vast majority of views that the alt-right does. This is why nobody takes anti-feminists seriously. Most of them can't even be honest about what they are.

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        • bigbudchonga

          You're completely absurd. By your reckoning the vast majority of the population are alt-right. People don't agree with feminism because they don't like the bullshit hypocritical movement it's become. only 7% of British women agree with feminism yet the vast majority of them want equality between the sexes. To genuinely believe that 93% of British women are alt-right is absolutely fucking ludicrous. People like you are why I fucking hate being left wing, so many of our side are just bigoted nutjobs who can't contemplate any other viewpoint without saying it comes from "Nazis" or the "alt-right".

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        • Dover939

          H3H3, who is a liberal.

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        • Protagoras

          Exactly

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    • rayb12

      Are you not perpetuating patriarchy (by your own definition) by calling men displaying emotion 'whining' and 'throwing a hissy fit'?

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      • Protagoras

        Nope, I'm not saying men can't show emotion. I'm stating a point that that's the immediate reaction to anything to do with "feminism", it's immediately just "OOOOHHHH, FEMINISM?! CRINGE MAN! JUST CRINGE! FUCKING WOMEN JUST WANT TO HAVE SUPERIORITY OVER US THAT'S THE END ALL GAME!!"

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        • rayb12

          Ok and what about this ‘whining about suicide’?

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          • Protagoras

            What I'm saying is that they constantly bring up the suicide ratio between men and women, but what do you think is a major contributor to that? "Men are supposed to be tough, men are supposed to bottle up their emotions" those are gender roles, that's part of patriarchy. But the second those terms come up it's like a trigger for MRAs and they just start bashing feminism.

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            • rayb12

              I see, so if im getting this right your argument broadly speaking is that feminism helps men at least in this specific case of suicide, and that the anti feminists you’ve encountered dont have a correct understanding of feminism and thus dont see this?

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    • Hubbard

      I really recommend the YouTube channel Dr Shaym

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  • SwickDinging

    A small minority of mouthy people do not speak for the majority of women. Talk to actual western women you meet in real life to find out what feminism means to them.

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  • RoseIsabella

    I think this isn't about Feminism so much as it's about what Feminism has become. Third Wave Feminism is crap! Nowadays people get triggered about everything. I'd rather hear people say stupid things that I don't agree with than lose freedom of speech. So many people today don't appreciate their rights. People are too busy getting offended.

    I'm glad I discovered Rucka Rucka Ali!

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  • angryblonde

    Can you elaborate please? What special privileges are feminists trying to get?

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    • xxLucifer

      The real question should be is, What rights/privileges do women not have that men do in western society? I can think of a few privileges that women have, but can't really think of anything off the top of my head for ones that men have.

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      • angryblonde

        Men don’t have to worry about walking around alone in fear of getting raped and then try to get help if they do get raped and then be asked “Well, we’re you drinking? What were you wearing? Did you give the man who raped you mixed signals?” etc. If we get raped, the blame is usually put on us.

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        • xxLucifer

          First off, women don't have to fear getting raped. The 1 in 5 women being raped statistic is from a CDC survey that is far higher than what actually occurred due to the nature of the questions. One question asked ""When you were drunk, high, drugged, or passed out and unable to consent, how many people ever" "had vaginal sex with you," "made you receive anal sex," or "made you perform oral sex." Eight percent of women said that did happen, but how many of them were just drunk or high? If a man has sex while drunk it just seen as a stupid mistake not rape, but if a woman has sex while drunk it's rape. I don't know about you, but that seems like a pretty big double standard.

          The Justice Department's statistics based on the National Crime Victimization Survey, which was done with a larger number of people and a higher response rate than the CDC's, found that in 2011 there were an estimated 238,000 rapes and assaults. Compare that to the CDC's 2011 estimate where they said over 2 million of adult American women were raped or sexually assaulted. Something doesn't seem right when you happen to do that.

          Secondly police don't ask questions like that except maybe if you were drinking. In America it's innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It's not that women are blamed for it, it's that it's very hard to prove rape as it ends up being a "he said she said" argument with very little evidence to prove that it has occurred. Also approximately only 310 out of 1000 rapes are reported. If you want more people to go to jail for rape then the easiest way would be to encourage people who have been victims to speak out.

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          • angryblonde

            Also I can’t believe you really said “Out of the 8% of the women, how many of them were just drunk or high?” You are scum. It doesn’t matter if you’re a man or woman. If you are drunk or high it doesn’t fucking matter. You can’t give consent.

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            • xxLucifer

              So whos to say both parties weren't drunk? Typically people drink in groups. What happens if both parties can't consent? Is it still the mans fault? These are the kind of questions that arise when you use that logic in an actual court case.

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          • angryblonde

            Oh my god. How did you not understand my point. No one should have to go through the shame of getting raped and try to muster up the courage to tell the police and then one of the first things the police asks is “What were you wearing?” and shit like that. It’s like saying “Well maybe if you weren’t wearing that short skirt, you wouldnt have got raped.”

            Now, since you have so many statistics, tell me how many men get raped and when they go to the police they ask them what they were wearing. Also statistically, do women or men get raped more?

            Also, I’m not saying that men don’t get raped because I know they do, but in most cases it’s against another man in prison, a pedophile, etc. I don’t know about you, but most men don’t say no to a piece of ass when intoxicated unless they’re in a relationship or physically incoherent and/or passed out. If you are so drunk you can barely walk, male or female IT IS RAPE AND SHOULD BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY.

            But let’s be honest. An average male is much bigger and stronger than the average female. Most times if a crazy sex addicted bitch comes on to a man with him not wanting it, he could easily push her off. The only way I can see an average sized man getting raped by a woman is if they were drugged and tied up or passed out, or too drugged to move well or she’s just a big strong evil bitch, or she has a gun. I don’t hear about that kind of shit happening.

            Women are statistically smaller and weaker than men and most often have no chance against a man unless she has a weapon.

            All I was trying to say is no one should have to take any responsibility for being raped. No matter what they were wearing, whether they were drinking, etc. If a man got raped they wouldn’t ask him what he was wearing.

            Also, I have a question for you. Consider you have a 16 year old daughter and a 16 year old son. Who would you be more worried about walking around alone? Who is more vulnerable alone? Who is more likely to be able to defend themselves? Who is the most targeted?

            If you ask ANY woman no matter what age, they will tell you they feel uneasy walking outside even if it’s daytime if they are alone and without a weapon. Unless maybe you ask fucking Cris Cyborg.

            Every woman subconsciously or consciously don’t want to walk alone and without a weapon. That is why you see women talking on the phone when they’re walking alone. I even do it when I’m walking to the fucking store during the day and i’ve never even been raped. I shouldn’t feel the need to do that. No one should.

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      • factcheck

        Try not watching Fox News or reading Breitbart for a day. You'll find a whole lot of things.

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        • xxLucifer

          Try getting out of your own echo chamber and you'll find a whole lot of things.

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          • bigbudchonga

            loooool. You're on point Lucifer.

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  • sdjlfakls

    the biggest propagators of feminism these days are actually butthurt men using it as a scapegoat / straw man for online arguments rooted in their own sexual frustrations. their opinions are based off youtube videos, sensationalist media, and reddit communities rather than their immediate reality; in which they would quickly realize that western feminism has absolutely no bearing anymore. it's just another antequated novelty like religion.

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  • xxLucifer

    Feminism as a whole completely contradicts the message they are putting out. I want equal rights for all and that's why I call myself an egalitarian not a feminist. Feminism seems to think that there way is the only way and have this "either with use or against us" mentality. A lot of the outspoken feminists don't even seem knowledgeable in what women in other countries have to deal with, some even going as far as saying that sharia law is good for women.

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    • angryblonde

      Feminism is supposed to be equality for both sexes. Feminazi is what prefers women.

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      • xxLucifer

        That's not how groups work. The "not all feminists" or "no true feminist" arguments don't actually work. Like I said as a whole feminism contradicts itself. What you consider a "feminazi" is what most people consider the whole group itself because that is the largest or at the very least the most vocal part of the group. There are dozens if not hundreds of videos online of feminists just yelling and spouting the same nonsense that has been disproven time and time again such as the "pink tax" or the "wage gap".

        It's not just angry people on the internet either. Linda Sarsour if you don't know was one of the organizers of the women's march in 2017. She is an advocate for sharia law even going as far as saying "sharia law is reasonable" and "it makes a lot of sense". This isn't a single person either. There is many feminists that have that feeling about sharia law and still think islam is a religion of peace despite the kind of things going on in the middle east because of sharia law.

        I'm not saying that all feminists are like this, I had a friend in high school who was a feminists and didn't hold crazy beliefs, but what I'm saying is that the most vocal part of the group is going to be what people associate as the group. If the most vocal people of the group are idiots then either the other members of the group have to be even louder or they have to break away and make there own group.

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        • factcheck

          Just a heads up, you instantly lose all credibility when you write something as asinine as your nonsensical claim that the wage gap has been disproven. It's an inarguable fact. That's like saying gravity has been disproven.

          It's funny that you mention sharia law, given that American Christians love sharia law so much, they just call it "religious freedom" instead. And considering the hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians Christians have killed in the middle east, Islam is peaceful by comparison.

          So when are the supposed peaceful, non-sexist, non-bigoted Christians going to break away and make their own group?

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          • ScooterNyne

            Well the wage gap has been disproven by several economists and there are more than enough studies to back up the claim. Nothing is more credible in my mind than properly studied/conveyed statistics. I doubt anyone could produce more sources that support the wage gap than ones that don't. And that's partly due to the fact that (1)unequal pay is illegal and (2)business's are profiting from the wage gap trend lol.

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          • angryblonde

            You are so intelligent. I appreciate you. You word things so much better than I can.

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        • angryblonde

          I’m a feminist, and all I want is for men and women to be equal. Literally equal.

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          • xxLucifer

            Yeah like I said you can say that, but the most vocal and loudest part of the group don't share those views or at the very least have a skewed version of that view.

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            • angryblonde

              they’re the most vocal and loud because they have some kind of mental illness. they’re legit crazy. don’t lump me in with those insane people.

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  • aliswho

    Western feminism is stupid. Females nowadays claim feminism to be equal rights but in reality they just think and try to be superior to men. It's stupid, and women should be put back into their place.

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  • CozmoWank

    What do Northern feminists want?

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  • badmanalive

    This question can be answered with two simple questions:

    1: Is a female more important than a male?

    1: Is a male more important than a female?

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  • bigbudchonga

    Western Feminism has become the monster it was created to fight. It's really sad seeing as what a great movement it once was.

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  • CozmoWank

    What do Eastern Feminists want?

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    • xxLucifer

      Eastern feminists are the people who are fighting for women who are actually oppressed like the middle east for simple rights such as being able to drive, being able to leave the house, get an education, get a job, open a bank account, or get elective surgery without a male guardian, being able to wear something besides a hijab. The list goes on and on. I know that's just the middle east, but I don't know any other region that is as oppressive towards women.

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      • factcheck

        Christianity, for one. All of the things you listed were things that women couldn't do in the US for the vast majority of its existence...and it was secularists fighting Christians every step of the way to earn those rights for women.

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        • xxLucifer

          First of I said region not religion. Secondly those women in the middle east are still subjugated in those ways in Muslim societies and that doesn't happen in predominantly Christian societies. For "feminists" in the west to complain about trivial things like the wage gap or pink tax, which both aren't actually things, is ludicrous when there are women who put there life on the line to speak out against these things in the middle east that are seen as basic rights for western civilizations.

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  • Bazinga

    Sex positive feminism makes some sense. Feminists who like to fuck get along better with men than feminists who don't.

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  • mattypattpatt

    Feminism is a complex issue that uses heavily opinionated and frankly obfuscated terminology. This leads to a lot of confusion between different peoples definitions of "real" feminism, versus so-called "feminazism". So yeah, totally normal.

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  • Men must be trained to be men and women to be women.

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