"That means it's not what it claims to be. We're not arguing about what it claims to be. We're arguing on if it's made up or not."
It claims to be not made up, aka the word of an all-powerful being who wouldn't put things in it that aren't true. If it's not a good moral guide or an accurate historical account, then all it is is fiction. And since it's fiction, it's made up. You're just not connecting the dots.
"Until you give me proof all 40+ authors of the Bible were writing their imaginations down, gg."
Okay. Let's see how far I can go pointing out the flaws of each book that prove how fake it is until I get bored and decide its not worth doing every single one.
Genesis contains the creation story and the Noah's ark story, so it's not true. So somebody was clearly talking out of their ass here.
Exodus has the part where sorcerers turn sticks into living snakes and condones slavery. Oh and God kills a bunch of people and their kids. So somebody was probably trying to write a horror story or something, but it's definitely not historical in the least!
Leviticus has the science problems I mentioned in my original post, and voodoo (like God's way of curing leprosy with dead birds.)that actually works in the Bible but not in real life. Yet more made up stuff by some desert hooligan.
Numbers has a ton of deaths that are never mentioned in real history. Thousands of people, several cities, getting wiped out. But nodody ever seems to care according to historical records because there's no real-life evidence of this stuff. Oh and Moses is pretty evil in this one, which means God was wrong about him, but God can't be wrong so someone just wrote this stuff down without ever thinking about it. Just more made-up fictional BS.
Deuteronomy claims you must follow all the rules listed in it or God will have your wife raped and force you to eat your own children. Since there's so many rules in it that are hard to follow, yet nobody's ever been forced by God to eat their own children, it's safe to say this book is made up. Otherwise we'd be a constantly cannibalistic species with a low population if this author was telling the truth.
Joshua says that God cursed the gibeonites to be the slaves of the Jews forever. This never actually happens. Someone made it up. Enough said.
Judges has even more massacres that somehow never God recorded, also a ton of god-inspired evil happens in it yet again showing us that it's wrong, and thus isn't true. And if it's not true, it'd made up.
Okay, you've got me at the book of Ruth. It could very well be real. Nothing impossible happens in it, and it's consistent about its characters and the world they live in. That doesn't mean the other books aren't made up though.
Samuel has plenty of massacring that never happened, evil inspired by God. (proving God isn't perfect, which proves that the Bible isn't the inspired word of God, which proves it isn't what it claims to be, which proves its fiction, which proves its made up. If I don't point out this entire freaking list, you'll forget it's there and think I'm mixing different things together.)
So on and so forth, Samuel is made up.
Samuel 2 was made by the same author, so I'm not even gonna look into that. We already know he's a liar.
Kings 1 & 2 have still more undocumented massacres and injustices made by a perfect being. Oh and if you refuse to assist someone in suicide God will send a lion after you. This never happens, so we can be sure it's just made up.
I'm kings 2 I feel like I should mention that this guy named Isiah makes the sun move backwards by ten degrees. So impossible I think even you can see how this one's definitely fake.
Chronicles 1 & 2 are both so inconsistent with what the previous Bible stories say, that this means whoever wrote them was just filling in the parts they didn't know. That makes it made up.
Ezra makes the claim that your sperm is corrupted if you take a foreign wife. This isn't true, men with foreign wives have sperm that works just like everyone else's. So fake.
Nehemiah is boring but contradictory with Ezra. This means that whoever's the author used their imagination to fill on the parts they didn't know. Other than that, Nehemiah may just be true. Might be fake, might not be.
Ester has the bad moral stories and such that show its not what it claims to be, and that's a factual historical account inspired by God. It's not factual, it's not good, so it's fiction. Which means it's made up.
Job is made up for the same reasons as Ester.
Psalms isn't a historical account or a moral guide, so it can't really be made up or factual.
Proverbs: Beat your children and your slaves. Clearly made up by some sheep-herding asshole, not someone inspired by a perfect being.
Isiah says God will you kill your brother and eat your in arm. Oh and the people God kills will rot and burn... FOREVER! Remember that hell hasn't been created yet at this point, which means that whoever wrote this is saying that somewhere there are giant piles of burning, rotting bodies from the many thousands of people God killed. Not true, made up, blah blah blah moving on.
Jeremiah makes a lot of nasty worldwide prophecies of mass cannibalism and god-inspired genocide that never take place irl. Oh and it claims cockatrices exist, which they don't, so it's just another fantasy story that was made up.
Lamentations claims a lot of stuff, but it's not really specific and a lot of it is metaphors and stuff. So I'm gonna go with the idea that this one was never really meant to portray history and facts in the first place. There's a lot of god-induced evil still, of course. But I wouldn't say I know this one is fake.
You can see the course this is going, with most of the Bible books being made-up garbage and those that aren't were never intended to be historical with specific truths. The only ones I can't fact check are the ones with really vague facts, or are just about the personal lives of people like Ruth and the Song of Solomon.
All of your points were just "It's fake" and "there's no evidence" and "it's wrong." It's not about connecting the dots.
I'll ignore the ones you just say "it's fake," since you provide no proof they are. About the "no evidence" part then. No evidence of something doesn't mean it's fake. It means there's no evidence of something.
Next, about you saying it's morally wrong in places. Cool and awesome. As I've already stated, I don't care about that. That doesn't prove it's fake.
There was one particular thing that caught my eye.
If it's not a good moral guide or an accurate historical account, then all it is is fiction. And since it's fiction, it's made up. You're just not connecting the dots."
Learn what the word "fiction" means. Again, the Bible being immoral doesn't mean it's all fiction. The Bible being wrong in SOME facts doesn't mean it's all fiction. Besides, no evidence it happened doesn't mean it didn't happen.
Also, parts of the Bible are indeed tales. They're meant to teach a lesson. It's not just a history book.
"The Bible sometimes aims to give an historical chronicle of actual events that really occurred. At other times, it employs poetry, myth, or fiction, in order to convey truth according to one of these genres."
It includes false things purposefully, to teach. That doesn't mean the Bible is all fiction, and therefore made up.
I have a couple questions. Let's say I do a school project on World War II. I get a fact wrong and say that it ended in 1946 instead of 1945. Does that mean my whole project is fiction, and therefore made up?
At the end, I want to tell everyone how wrong the Nazis were. After all, it's part of my project. So I tell a story I made up about the Nazis to show their evil. It's not true, but it's something they would have done. It's meant to teach a lesson. But since I included fiction, is all my project fiction, and therefore made up?
If you answer these two obvious questions correctly, ask the same exact questions of the Bible.
Hint: The answers might be the exact same, and are just as obvious.
It's not about connecting the dots. It's about not squashing different things and putting them into one false statement.
You are saying in this post that it's made up. How can you not admit it to yourself? And before you post something saying you didn't say that, read your own post. Conveying truth is still fiction. The bible is not a history book. But if you make something up regardless of intent means it's fiction.
fic·tion
[ˈfikSH(ə)n]
NOUN
literature in the form of prose, especially short stories and novels, that describes imaginary events and people.
synonyms: novels · stories · (creative) writing · (prose) literature · lit
invention or fabrication as opposed to fact:
"he dismissed the allegation as absolute fiction"
synonyms: fabrication · invention · lies · fibs · untruth · falsehood · fantasy · nonsense
a belief or statement that is false, but that is often held to be true because it is expedient to do so:
"the notion of that country being a democracy is a polite fiction"
The second question's answer is yes it is fiction, you made up the story. Your project still has merit because it's something the nazis would have done, but that doesn't mean it's not maze up.
What defines "made up" to you? It sure seems like in order for anything to be made up, it'd have to be wrong about every single fact and everything it says would have to be impossible.
It's not supposed to be a 100% perfectly divinely inspired holy book. Parts of it are wrong, yes. That doesn't mean the Bible is all made up, which is what we're arguing about. So you finally agree with me that the Bible isn't made up?
I repeat: the Bible is made up. Just because there are some portions that may be accurate, like how Egyptians exist both in real life and in the Bible, that doesn't mean it's not fictional.
"It's not supposed to be a 100% perfectly divinely inspired holy book"
You're saying the Bible wasn't supposed to be divinely inspired? Some Christians may take offense to that.
Nice job ignoring what I say. Doesn't matter what Christians think. The argument is that you can't prove it's made up. Innacuracy in parts of it don't prove it's made up, it proves it's inaccurate in parts.
As for the last part, no, I'm saying it's not perfect in accuracy.
Okay fine I'll reply. I didn't say it was ALL fiction. I pointed out that in order to be true, it'd have to uphold its own claims. It doesn't. Parts of it are wrong and made up, and yet it claims not to be. Simple as that.
"Let's see how far I can go pointing out the flaws of each book that prove how fake it is until I get bored and decide its not worth doing every single one."
You did indeed say it's all fiction, so that's a lie from you. Also, no it doesn't have to uphold its claims to be true. That's just simply wrong. If I state a fact and don't provide evidence for it, does that mean it's not true? No.
"Parts of it are wrong and made up, and yet it claims not to be. Simple as that."
I've talked about this my last comment, I won't talk about it again. Doesn't look like you're on the winning side so far.
So if I wrote something down full of absurd stories with contradictions and making bizzare claims like "if you eat olives without tomato sauce, the great tehedraton will smite your stomach" and to top it off I said what I wrote down is perfect and divinely inspired, you'd be willing to argue that no one can prove that what I wrote could just be made up?
is it normal to think the bible is bs
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"That means it's not what it claims to be. We're not arguing about what it claims to be. We're arguing on if it's made up or not."
It claims to be not made up, aka the word of an all-powerful being who wouldn't put things in it that aren't true. If it's not a good moral guide or an accurate historical account, then all it is is fiction. And since it's fiction, it's made up. You're just not connecting the dots.
"Until you give me proof all 40+ authors of the Bible were writing their imaginations down, gg."
Okay. Let's see how far I can go pointing out the flaws of each book that prove how fake it is until I get bored and decide its not worth doing every single one.
Genesis contains the creation story and the Noah's ark story, so it's not true. So somebody was clearly talking out of their ass here.
Exodus has the part where sorcerers turn sticks into living snakes and condones slavery. Oh and God kills a bunch of people and their kids. So somebody was probably trying to write a horror story or something, but it's definitely not historical in the least!
Leviticus has the science problems I mentioned in my original post, and voodoo (like God's way of curing leprosy with dead birds.)that actually works in the Bible but not in real life. Yet more made up stuff by some desert hooligan.
Numbers has a ton of deaths that are never mentioned in real history. Thousands of people, several cities, getting wiped out. But nodody ever seems to care according to historical records because there's no real-life evidence of this stuff. Oh and Moses is pretty evil in this one, which means God was wrong about him, but God can't be wrong so someone just wrote this stuff down without ever thinking about it. Just more made-up fictional BS.
Deuteronomy claims you must follow all the rules listed in it or God will have your wife raped and force you to eat your own children. Since there's so many rules in it that are hard to follow, yet nobody's ever been forced by God to eat their own children, it's safe to say this book is made up. Otherwise we'd be a constantly cannibalistic species with a low population if this author was telling the truth.
Joshua says that God cursed the gibeonites to be the slaves of the Jews forever. This never actually happens. Someone made it up. Enough said.
Judges has even more massacres that somehow never God recorded, also a ton of god-inspired evil happens in it yet again showing us that it's wrong, and thus isn't true. And if it's not true, it'd made up.
Okay, you've got me at the book of Ruth. It could very well be real. Nothing impossible happens in it, and it's consistent about its characters and the world they live in. That doesn't mean the other books aren't made up though.
Samuel has plenty of massacring that never happened, evil inspired by God. (proving God isn't perfect, which proves that the Bible isn't the inspired word of God, which proves it isn't what it claims to be, which proves its fiction, which proves its made up. If I don't point out this entire freaking list, you'll forget it's there and think I'm mixing different things together.)
So on and so forth, Samuel is made up.
Samuel 2 was made by the same author, so I'm not even gonna look into that. We already know he's a liar.
Kings 1 & 2 have still more undocumented massacres and injustices made by a perfect being. Oh and if you refuse to assist someone in suicide God will send a lion after you. This never happens, so we can be sure it's just made up.
I'm kings 2 I feel like I should mention that this guy named Isiah makes the sun move backwards by ten degrees. So impossible I think even you can see how this one's definitely fake.
Chronicles 1 & 2 are both so inconsistent with what the previous Bible stories say, that this means whoever wrote them was just filling in the parts they didn't know. That makes it made up.
Ezra makes the claim that your sperm is corrupted if you take a foreign wife. This isn't true, men with foreign wives have sperm that works just like everyone else's. So fake.
Nehemiah is boring but contradictory with Ezra. This means that whoever's the author used their imagination to fill on the parts they didn't know. Other than that, Nehemiah may just be true. Might be fake, might not be.
Ester has the bad moral stories and such that show its not what it claims to be, and that's a factual historical account inspired by God. It's not factual, it's not good, so it's fiction. Which means it's made up.
Job is made up for the same reasons as Ester.
Psalms isn't a historical account or a moral guide, so it can't really be made up or factual.
Proverbs: Beat your children and your slaves. Clearly made up by some sheep-herding asshole, not someone inspired by a perfect being.
Isiah says God will you kill your brother and eat your in arm. Oh and the people God kills will rot and burn... FOREVER! Remember that hell hasn't been created yet at this point, which means that whoever wrote this is saying that somewhere there are giant piles of burning, rotting bodies from the many thousands of people God killed. Not true, made up, blah blah blah moving on.
Jeremiah makes a lot of nasty worldwide prophecies of mass cannibalism and god-inspired genocide that never take place irl. Oh and it claims cockatrices exist, which they don't, so it's just another fantasy story that was made up.
Lamentations claims a lot of stuff, but it's not really specific and a lot of it is metaphors and stuff. So I'm gonna go with the idea that this one was never really meant to portray history and facts in the first place. There's a lot of god-induced evil still, of course. But I wouldn't say I know this one is fake.
You can see the course this is going, with most of the Bible books being made-up garbage and those that aren't were never intended to be historical with specific truths. The only ones I can't fact check are the ones with really vague facts, or are just about the personal lives of people like Ruth and the Song of Solomon.
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Pumpurrnickel
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All of your points were just "It's fake" and "there's no evidence" and "it's wrong." It's not about connecting the dots.
I'll ignore the ones you just say "it's fake," since you provide no proof they are. About the "no evidence" part then. No evidence of something doesn't mean it's fake. It means there's no evidence of something.
Next, about you saying it's morally wrong in places. Cool and awesome. As I've already stated, I don't care about that. That doesn't prove it's fake.
There was one particular thing that caught my eye.
If it's not a good moral guide or an accurate historical account, then all it is is fiction. And since it's fiction, it's made up. You're just not connecting the dots."
Learn what the word "fiction" means. Again, the Bible being immoral doesn't mean it's all fiction. The Bible being wrong in SOME facts doesn't mean it's all fiction. Besides, no evidence it happened doesn't mean it didn't happen.
Also, parts of the Bible are indeed tales. They're meant to teach a lesson. It's not just a history book.
https://www.catholiceducation.org/en/religion-and-philosophy/apologetics/are-the-stories-in-the-bible-true.html
"The Bible sometimes aims to give an historical chronicle of actual events that really occurred. At other times, it employs poetry, myth, or fiction, in order to convey truth according to one of these genres."
It includes false things purposefully, to teach. That doesn't mean the Bible is all fiction, and therefore made up.
I have a couple questions. Let's say I do a school project on World War II. I get a fact wrong and say that it ended in 1946 instead of 1945. Does that mean my whole project is fiction, and therefore made up?
At the end, I want to tell everyone how wrong the Nazis were. After all, it's part of my project. So I tell a story I made up about the Nazis to show their evil. It's not true, but it's something they would have done. It's meant to teach a lesson. But since I included fiction, is all my project fiction, and therefore made up?
If you answer these two obvious questions correctly, ask the same exact questions of the Bible.
Hint: The answers might be the exact same, and are just as obvious.
It's not about connecting the dots. It's about not squashing different things and putting them into one false statement.
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You are saying in this post that it's made up. How can you not admit it to yourself? And before you post something saying you didn't say that, read your own post. Conveying truth is still fiction. The bible is not a history book. But if you make something up regardless of intent means it's fiction.
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Pumpurrnickel
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Let's not get this started up again, maybe?
Not even my post.
No it's not. I've already explained why. I'm not arguing about this yet again.
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Ok. But the definition of made-up is
ADJECTIVE
1.wearing makeup:
"her immaculately made-up face"
2.invented; not true:
"a made-up story"
The stories in the bible are stolen from other religions. There is historical documents proving the alteration of the bible by the church.
fic·tion
[ˈfikSH(ə)n]
NOUN
literature in the form of prose, especially short stories and novels, that describes imaginary events and people.
synonyms: novels · stories · (creative) writing · (prose) literature · lit
invention or fabrication as opposed to fact:
"he dismissed the allegation as absolute fiction"
synonyms: fabrication · invention · lies · fibs · untruth · falsehood · fantasy · nonsense
a belief or statement that is false, but that is often held to be true because it is expedient to do so:
"the notion of that country being a democracy is a polite fiction"
The second question's answer is yes it is fiction, you made up the story. Your project still has merit because it's something the nazis would have done, but that doesn't mean it's not maze up.
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You got the wrong answer. The answer is that one story doesn't mean my whole project is made up.
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What defines "made up" to you? It sure seems like in order for anything to be made up, it'd have to be wrong about every single fact and everything it says would have to be impossible.
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Made up means made up. What you're arguing is that those authors are wrong in their facts, which instantly means the Bible is made up.
Innacurate facts doesn't equal made up.
That's your whole issue with this. You think:
Wrong facts = made up.
Made up is using your imagination. There is no possible way for you to prove that.
Oh and the first question is that no it's not made up. But your essay isn't supposed to be a 100% perfect divinely inspired holy book.
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It's not supposed to be a 100% perfectly divinely inspired holy book. Parts of it are wrong, yes. That doesn't mean the Bible is all made up, which is what we're arguing about. So you finally agree with me that the Bible isn't made up?
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I repeat: the Bible is made up. Just because there are some portions that may be accurate, like how Egyptians exist both in real life and in the Bible, that doesn't mean it's not fictional.
"It's not supposed to be a 100% perfectly divinely inspired holy book"
You're saying the Bible wasn't supposed to be divinely inspired? Some Christians may take offense to that.
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Nice job ignoring what I say. Doesn't matter what Christians think. The argument is that you can't prove it's made up. Innacuracy in parts of it don't prove it's made up, it proves it's inaccurate in parts.
As for the last part, no, I'm saying it's not perfect in accuracy.
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"Innacuracy in parts of it don't prove it's made up" so in order to be made up it would have to be 100% innaccurate?
"Nice job ignoring what I say" Speak for yourself.
"The argument is that you can't prove it's made up" I always thought that things that were inaccurate and fictional were made up.
Okay fine I'll reply. I didn't say it was ALL fiction. I pointed out that in order to be true, it'd have to uphold its own claims. It doesn't. Parts of it are wrong and made up, and yet it claims not to be. Simple as that.
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"Let's see how far I can go pointing out the flaws of each book that prove how fake it is until I get bored and decide its not worth doing every single one."
You did indeed say it's all fiction, so that's a lie from you. Also, no it doesn't have to uphold its claims to be true. That's just simply wrong. If I state a fact and don't provide evidence for it, does that mean it's not true? No.
"Parts of it are wrong and made up, and yet it claims not to be. Simple as that."
I've talked about this my last comment, I won't talk about it again. Doesn't look like you're on the winning side so far.
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CreamPuffs
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You talked about it sure, but what you said was wrong, so I felt the need to emphasize that.
So if I wrote something down full of absurd stories with contradictions and making bizzare claims like "if you eat olives without tomato sauce, the great tehedraton will smite your stomach" and to top it off I said what I wrote down is perfect and divinely inspired, you'd be willing to argue that no one can prove that what I wrote could just be made up?