I believe soldiering is a job not an act of heroism. I feel the same about firemen, policemen, and fisherman. I'm glad somebody does it, and I don't deny they are brave, but it's still a job and I don't think it entitles you to special treatment.
However, in your specific case, I can't see that your brother has much more special treatment than most people get. God only knows why his co-workers are carping at him and I think they should probably just shut the fuck up and get on with something productive; like working. Actually, maybe that's it. Maybe his work ethic is making them feel insecure so they're picking on whatever they can. Either way, they sound pathetic.
I was divorcing heroism from a "cause" and talking about something more important; personal bravery. In England, the most dangerous job (in terms of loss of life) is fishing.
Soldiers fight when there is a war (even a war that few people agree with, such as trying to bring about cheaper oil). It is dangerous and they are brave and every country tells itself that they are protecting their country. We make films about it and we brand them heroes. The reality of how veterans are treated shows how governments really consider them, which is - in itself - shameful. But it is a job with a salary like any other. It's not a mission people take on independently.
Compare it to fishermen, though. Their war with the sea is lifelong. They die horrible deaths with alarming regularity. Their bravery isn't in defence of a country, it's just to catch fish. They risk their lives more readily than soldiers (statistically) and have less of a reason to do it.
It's like the difference between tackling a burglar in your own home, and risking your life to feed your neighbours.
I'm still very intrigued. At the risk of making you believe that I am arguing with you, let me inform you that my questions are merely exploratory in terms of the subject and your opinion...
What of the act of heroism in taking the risky job that millions WON'T take (as statistically, most people do not serve in the Armed forces)? Or do you consider the willingness to take the risk and willingness to sign up for a possible fatality on a battlefield not "heroic"?
Oh, don't worry. I'm always happier to talk something through than have people think "That guy's a dick" but never try to see if there's any validity in my opinion.
To preface my answer, of all the heroic acts I've heard of (and which have stuck with me), by far the greater proportion of them have been in the theatre of war. But these are individual acts by extraordinary people.
The point I was trying to make is that you don't automatically become a hero because you're in the military. Nor do you become a hero just because you've been injured (another point of view that doesn't sit well with people, but logically there's no link. Even if you were injured saving someone's life, you'd be equally heroic if you hadn't been injured but had achieved the same thing). It might be a coldly logical way of looking at it, but it is technically true.
To answer your specific question, though, yes, I'd agree there was some heroism involved in your example if protecting one's country was the primary reason for joining the military (and if it wasn't a paid occupation). I have friends in the army and navy, plus some ex-army friends. Although they were proud to defend their country, there were plenty of other reasons they joined up, reasons that were higher up their lists.
Lack (or dislike) of an academic education and little other employment prospects were two, but the main reason by far is that they thought they'd enjoy it (get paid well, keep fit, travel the world, get to play with guns and tanks). The actuality of soldiering (from their point of view) was more about how to stave off boredom. None of them feels like or would ever imagine themselves heroic. Although it's nothing like a conventional job, it is still just a job.
Although one thing I will concede: being in the military gives you plenty more options to be heroic and to become a hero.
IIN to hate that people are angry for how my brother got his job?
← View full post
I believe soldiering is a job not an act of heroism. I feel the same about firemen, policemen, and fisherman. I'm glad somebody does it, and I don't deny they are brave, but it's still a job and I don't think it entitles you to special treatment.
However, in your specific case, I can't see that your brother has much more special treatment than most people get. God only knows why his co-workers are carping at him and I think they should probably just shut the fuck up and get on with something productive; like working. Actually, maybe that's it. Maybe his work ethic is making them feel insecure so they're picking on whatever they can. Either way, they sound pathetic.
--
VioletTrees
11 years ago
|
pl
Comment Hidden (
show
)
Report
0
0
-
Anonymous Post Author
11 years ago
|
pl
Comment Hidden (
show
)
Report
0
0
I read that as "I believe soldering is a job not an act of heroism", and it was much less controversial.
--
dappled
11 years ago
|
pl
Comment Hidden (
show
)
Report
0
0
That's exactly how I meant it, yeah. I wasn't even being critical of soldiers (it's a tough, dangerous job).
--
NeuroNeptunian
11 years ago
|
pl
Comment Hidden (
show
)
Report
0
0
I do not disagree with you, rather, I am intrigued by your statement and would like to hear your argument for it.
--
dappled
11 years ago
|
pl
Comment Hidden (
show
)
Report
1
1
I was divorcing heroism from a "cause" and talking about something more important; personal bravery. In England, the most dangerous job (in terms of loss of life) is fishing.
Soldiers fight when there is a war (even a war that few people agree with, such as trying to bring about cheaper oil). It is dangerous and they are brave and every country tells itself that they are protecting their country. We make films about it and we brand them heroes. The reality of how veterans are treated shows how governments really consider them, which is - in itself - shameful. But it is a job with a salary like any other. It's not a mission people take on independently.
Compare it to fishermen, though. Their war with the sea is lifelong. They die horrible deaths with alarming regularity. Their bravery isn't in defence of a country, it's just to catch fish. They risk their lives more readily than soldiers (statistically) and have less of a reason to do it.
It's like the difference between tackling a burglar in your own home, and risking your life to feed your neighbours.
--
NeuroNeptunian
11 years ago
|
pl
Comment Hidden (
show
)
Report
0
0
I'm still very intrigued. At the risk of making you believe that I am arguing with you, let me inform you that my questions are merely exploratory in terms of the subject and your opinion...
What of the act of heroism in taking the risky job that millions WON'T take (as statistically, most people do not serve in the Armed forces)? Or do you consider the willingness to take the risk and willingness to sign up for a possible fatality on a battlefield not "heroic"?
--
dappled
11 years ago
|
pl
Comment Hidden (
show
)
Report
0
0
See More Comments =>
Oh, don't worry. I'm always happier to talk something through than have people think "That guy's a dick" but never try to see if there's any validity in my opinion.
To preface my answer, of all the heroic acts I've heard of (and which have stuck with me), by far the greater proportion of them have been in the theatre of war. But these are individual acts by extraordinary people.
The point I was trying to make is that you don't automatically become a hero because you're in the military. Nor do you become a hero just because you've been injured (another point of view that doesn't sit well with people, but logically there's no link. Even if you were injured saving someone's life, you'd be equally heroic if you hadn't been injured but had achieved the same thing). It might be a coldly logical way of looking at it, but it is technically true.
To answer your specific question, though, yes, I'd agree there was some heroism involved in your example if protecting one's country was the primary reason for joining the military (and if it wasn't a paid occupation). I have friends in the army and navy, plus some ex-army friends. Although they were proud to defend their country, there were plenty of other reasons they joined up, reasons that were higher up their lists.
Lack (or dislike) of an academic education and little other employment prospects were two, but the main reason by far is that they thought they'd enjoy it (get paid well, keep fit, travel the world, get to play with guns and tanks). The actuality of soldiering (from their point of view) was more about how to stave off boredom. None of them feels like or would ever imagine themselves heroic. Although it's nothing like a conventional job, it is still just a job.
Although one thing I will concede: being in the military gives you plenty more options to be heroic and to become a hero.
I don't know what to say about your remarks regarding soldiers but you have given me something to think about. Thanks for your input.
--
dappled
11 years ago
|
pl
Comment Hidden (
show
)
Report
2
2
It's an unpopular opinion, I know, but I wasn't going to lie about it.