It's responses like these that are the reason I certainly wouldn't consider you to be blindly sexist or anything extreme like that. You still say things that make me grind my teeth, but that's just because we see things a different way.
I still must insist you cannot accurately say that the smartest person was a male. You can accurately say that the person with the highest tested and recorded IQ was a male, though. This is just a matter of using the right language when you present data. "Smartest" is an opinion. Intelligence isn't solely interpreted as IQ by everyone. Aptitude with language, ability to multitask, reading people, understanding psychology - those are all things that other people associate with being "smart". Same goes for "wisest" but even moreso. There isn't even a remotely standard test or measurement for wisdom. Half the people in Brooklyn will tell you their Gran is the wisest person in the world. Strength... well, you got me there. Guinness records point to a male, and I would guess that if someone was stronger and didn't make it in the book, it was likely a male as well.
It's fact that most inventions came from men, but it's also fact that men throughout history have held more freedoms and power than women. I could argue all day about how subjugation doesn't breed innovation, but potential is ever-present. Not a lot of slave laborers throughout history had brilliant inventions either. Doesn't mean they couldn't have done it, but they weren't given the chance.
Perhaps it is more socially acceptable for women to spout hatred and teach other women that fighting fire with fire is productive. I think that's appalling, but I don't know why YOU have a problem with it. You're all for fighting fire with fire! You're just ping-ponging it back and forth.
Also, the other side isn't without fact, either. Men are out to get the equal treatment they deserve? They already have a ton of advantages that women don't. That's how the whole feminist movement got started. There have been countless incidents recorded and brought to court about sex discrimination against women. Men still earn more money, are more readily hired against women with equal or better credentials, and enjoy their own list of "benefits" of being male. Why do you need second, third, and fourth chances when you still hold the majority of jobs against people who can prove they'd be just as good, when you make more money, when you have more power, when you hold the vast majority of political positions. EVERYBODY knows men certainly don't have the best history as politicians. Who's the last female representative or senator who got busted with a prostitute?
Both sides have an argument to make, but nothing changes the facts that the sexes are still not equally accepted even in modern society. The argument can go on and on with both sides pointing fingers and whining about how they're the victim and the other side has it so much better. Personally? I think spreading ridiculous opinions doesn't help the situation. Women shouldn't abuse child support to extort money out of men. Men shouldn't strip women of their rights to bare children (or not) in order to "get even".
Equality and justice are not born out of spreading hatred, nor are they born from meekly portraying the victim. Forgive the ironic expression, but both sides need to "man up"
If I'm NOT being very confusing right now (quoted: "you're not being very confusing right now") why are you not sure you know what I mean? (quoted: "I'm not sure I know what You mean.)
Perhaps this was an error and you didn't mean to put in a double negative.
"Do you always tell falsehoods" (There is no need to capitalize the "A" at the beginning of the word "always" in the middle of a sentence)
Logically, have you ever met anyone in your entire life who *always* told lies, or falsehoods? Always means 100% of the time. Do you believe that such a person even exists?
I do not. So the direct, logical answer is "no" I do not always tell lies or falsehoods.
Logically, you must be referring to something that you personally have chosen to interpret as a lie, or falsehood. The logical thing to do here is to give an example. What have you perceived to be a lie that I told?
What about people such as Einstein? Surely he was smarter than all people due to his findings and research, etc.
Nowadays, I'm unsure who is the smartest. Although I can't be completelty sure, and I can accept that, I believe the most likely person to be the smartest is a man. I say this because of all the acomplishments the male gender has done, and the things they have found out and made, and found are usually better than that of what females find, invent. Not saying they aren't smart, or geniuses, obviously they were, but I still believe the most likely person to be the smartest is a man. Aren't men better at math? Not sure if that was just a rumour or science facts. If it is facts, numbers and math I would say is the most needed thing in order to create, invent, evolve etc. If men are naturally better, then I think that gives a point to a man being the smartest.
What about Ghandi and such? (For the wise part).
Yes, women were by all means oppresed and not allowed to do such things as men. But, I find that a bit irritating. Surely if it was the case that they were "Just held back" they would been starting to make great creations by now that live up to what males have made?
I'm very up and forward in attitude about equality. I seen that males weren't getting their equal rights, either but don't have as much people defending that point, in which made me want to be on their side out of fairness.
How would you suggest a man even gets people to notice this? There are many male equality activists that try be civil, even when they go on TV shows for some time to speak about it, it is always filled with a man trying to say what he has to say, but the feminist activist on the show with him always speaking over him so that he can't have his say, in which case only the feminist gets heard. Being quiet isn't helping the male gender, they need to scream to be heard.
I agree completely with the original feminists. The new feminism is nothing like the old one. Like I've said to others, today's feminists are mainly for special treatment, under the disguise of equallity.
Yes, there has happened about sex assualts. However. You should know that 80% of sex assualts of women on men don't get taken seriously at all. An example of this would be when two 8th grade girls stripped an eleven year old boy while a third 8th grader girl recorded it. The boy was screaming for them to get off him, shouting for his mother, trying to keep his shorts on and they just kept doing it laughing.
Did these girls get punished even though it was all recorded? No. Guess how a report of the insident got classed as? "Just some girls playing a prank"... We know for a fact that if it was boys the same age doing it to an eleven year old, they would be facing so many charges. So I dissagree with you there. If a recorded sexual harrassment assault doesn't show as evidence, then why do you think men won't admit to being sexually assaulted or attacked by females?
Female sexual harrassment = Prank.
Male sexual harrassment = Rapist.
I listened to a video by "girlwriteswhat" a Youtuber. What she said made sense. She said that men are more likely to focus on their career before anything else, including family. Females however will put family ahead of work, in which would take away time, effort and success due to them nothaving work as their first priority. Is it wrong she puts her family first? No.
By men making work their prioprity before everything else unlike a woman, he is bound to put more effort, more time, and more likely to be successful in his workplace. Which is why he is likely to earn more. If a woman is doing the exact same time, she does get paid for it as much as a male does. It's feminists that have made this whole myth that females natrually get paid less for being female, because males are more likely to make it their number one priority. Also, females can fall pregnant. Falling pregnant involves time off, where as males don't have that problem, which is why they would be picked if their is a female with the samequalifications.
Women of power and control of couontries such as the queenirritates me. She has done nothing to help Britain, and it gets worse every year. Who are the ones that have to try solve the problems? The males that are lower in power from her.
The prositute one is a bit annoying. Males have always been people to seek out sex, it's in their nature and instinct. If a woman wastold togo against any of her natural instincts, we'dbe called sexist.
It's all fine and dandy to say we all have problems, and if we do, I still believe men have it worse, because females have the support of agencies and the goverment in which men don't have nearly as much support.
Also. The one that commented to you below "nobleserpant", he's a troll. If you reply to him in an intelligent way, he'll just keep attempting to troll. I started replying to him, no matter what he said "You're doing it wrong" and have told people he replies to to do the same, in which they believe it was a good thing to do. You don't need to reply to him, but if you do, simply repeat for every reply he sends"You're doing it wrong" basically saying he's/she's not doing a good job at trolling. It tends to irritate him/her and make them ignore you and not attemp trolling the person repeating it to them again.
The funny thing is, I agree with the vast majority of what you're saying. The story about the boy being assaulted by the two girls? It's awful, wasn't a prank, and is clearly sexual assault. I dislike gender inequality wherever it appears, on either side of the coin.
But I still don't agree with seeing it as black and white and treating it like a war. I just don't see any great possibility of success when you turn the same tactic back against your perpetrators.
To address a few points: Nobody is going to tell you Einstein wasn't smart, but I guarantee you if you picked the top 100 highest IQ people in the world and asked them who was the smartest, they wouldn't all say Einstein. Because it's an opinion still and always. Ghandi? Opinion. Mother Theresa, Joan of Arc, The Oracle at Delphi, Blavatsky, Maya Angelou, Florence Nightingale, Eleanor Roosevelt... all viable opinions, equally arguable.
The bit about assuming a women will do worse at her job because she cares about her family, and she gets paid less? Well, that's called sexism. "He is bound to put..." No. Stop right there. Companies get sued for that sort of thing and with good reason. It's discrimination. Unless they can prove with numbers and raw data that they're correct, which is a very rare occurrence compared to the number of incidents.
There is no myth about females getting paid less than males. It's solid fact, compiled from data that is gathered through legal means from legitimate companies and business practices. It is 100% undeniable fact with concrete empirical data behind it. The bit about them getting pregnant is also called discrimination, and is not a legal business practice. Ever read those posters in the break room at work about discrimination?
There are also plenty of facts I can throw at that twist the truth, just like some of the ones you have. I don't like doing it, but just so you know - the vast majority of rapists are men, the vast majority of serial killers are men, child molesters, criminals, murderers, drug dealers, arsonists, domestic abuse cases, etc. etc. etc.
Now... I personally don't think it's fair to use this, but it's all true. Just goes to show you what "fact" can be used for.
The prostitute thing... I'll concede the point. That can be argued to have more to do with our biological procreative methods as a species. Still, the morality argument could hold a strong candle to that. (continued)
And then your statement "I still believe men have it worse" well... I don't know how to say it without being rude, and it's not really my intention to belittle you for this viewpoint, but: that's pathetic. I mean, really? Victimization is just so unappealing to me. I hate it when women do it, and I hate it when men do it. 100% honestly? I hate it a little more when men do it because even I am a little bit influenced by the sexist belief that men should have some damn balls and not whine so much.
All in all I like to think that we have a similar goal - gender equality all around. I think we have different ideas on where the current inequality lies, and HOW to get to that equality we seek... but most people will. Maybe it's not that important in the end, if the outcome is the same, I can't really say. Also thank you for the note about the serpent guy, I wasn't sure what to make of him.
This has nothing to do with anything, but what the hell is trolling?? And btw im getting alot of amusment out of reading this debat. Great points of veiw on both sides.
IIN to get annoyed at the self-righteous judgemental posters here?
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It's responses like these that are the reason I certainly wouldn't consider you to be blindly sexist or anything extreme like that. You still say things that make me grind my teeth, but that's just because we see things a different way.
I still must insist you cannot accurately say that the smartest person was a male. You can accurately say that the person with the highest tested and recorded IQ was a male, though. This is just a matter of using the right language when you present data. "Smartest" is an opinion. Intelligence isn't solely interpreted as IQ by everyone. Aptitude with language, ability to multitask, reading people, understanding psychology - those are all things that other people associate with being "smart". Same goes for "wisest" but even moreso. There isn't even a remotely standard test or measurement for wisdom. Half the people in Brooklyn will tell you their Gran is the wisest person in the world. Strength... well, you got me there. Guinness records point to a male, and I would guess that if someone was stronger and didn't make it in the book, it was likely a male as well.
It's fact that most inventions came from men, but it's also fact that men throughout history have held more freedoms and power than women. I could argue all day about how subjugation doesn't breed innovation, but potential is ever-present. Not a lot of slave laborers throughout history had brilliant inventions either. Doesn't mean they couldn't have done it, but they weren't given the chance.
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PumpkinKate
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Perhaps it is more socially acceptable for women to spout hatred and teach other women that fighting fire with fire is productive. I think that's appalling, but I don't know why YOU have a problem with it. You're all for fighting fire with fire! You're just ping-ponging it back and forth.
Also, the other side isn't without fact, either. Men are out to get the equal treatment they deserve? They already have a ton of advantages that women don't. That's how the whole feminist movement got started. There have been countless incidents recorded and brought to court about sex discrimination against women. Men still earn more money, are more readily hired against women with equal or better credentials, and enjoy their own list of "benefits" of being male. Why do you need second, third, and fourth chances when you still hold the majority of jobs against people who can prove they'd be just as good, when you make more money, when you have more power, when you hold the vast majority of political positions. EVERYBODY knows men certainly don't have the best history as politicians. Who's the last female representative or senator who got busted with a prostitute?
Both sides have an argument to make, but nothing changes the facts that the sexes are still not equally accepted even in modern society. The argument can go on and on with both sides pointing fingers and whining about how they're the victim and the other side has it so much better. Personally? I think spreading ridiculous opinions doesn't help the situation. Women shouldn't abuse child support to extort money out of men. Men shouldn't strip women of their rights to bare children (or not) in order to "get even".
Equality and justice are not born out of spreading hatred, nor are they born from meekly portraying the victim. Forgive the ironic expression, but both sides need to "man up"
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nobleserpent
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[Old Memory]
11 years ago
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Hello there!
Do you Always tell lies?
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PumpkinKate
11 years ago
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Make sense and capitalize correctly, please.
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nobleserpent
11 years ago
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Yes, you're not being very confusing right now so I'm not sure I know what You mean.
I'll repeat it:
Do you Always tell falsehoods?
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PumpkinKate
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Let's use logic.
If I'm NOT being very confusing right now (quoted: "you're not being very confusing right now") why are you not sure you know what I mean? (quoted: "I'm not sure I know what You mean.)
Perhaps this was an error and you didn't mean to put in a double negative.
"Do you always tell falsehoods" (There is no need to capitalize the "A" at the beginning of the word "always" in the middle of a sentence)
Logically, have you ever met anyone in your entire life who *always* told lies, or falsehoods? Always means 100% of the time. Do you believe that such a person even exists?
I do not. So the direct, logical answer is "no" I do not always tell lies or falsehoods.
Logically, you must be referring to something that you personally have chosen to interpret as a lie, or falsehood. The logical thing to do here is to give an example. What have you perceived to be a lie that I told?
You're a big boy now. Use your words.
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nobleserpent
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Thank you for your Response. (It relieves me to know you're not as Intellectually Intimidated as ItDuz.)
Why can't I Capitalize "always"?
"No, I don't Always tell lies"
That's just what a good liar would say.
You Liberals always tend to be filthy dogs and liars but I'll give you a Chance to prove your sincerity:
With a simple Yes or No, will you be answering this question with No?
What about people such as Einstein? Surely he was smarter than all people due to his findings and research, etc.
Nowadays, I'm unsure who is the smartest. Although I can't be completelty sure, and I can accept that, I believe the most likely person to be the smartest is a man. I say this because of all the acomplishments the male gender has done, and the things they have found out and made, and found are usually better than that of what females find, invent. Not saying they aren't smart, or geniuses, obviously they were, but I still believe the most likely person to be the smartest is a man. Aren't men better at math? Not sure if that was just a rumour or science facts. If it is facts, numbers and math I would say is the most needed thing in order to create, invent, evolve etc. If men are naturally better, then I think that gives a point to a man being the smartest.
What about Ghandi and such? (For the wise part).
Yes, women were by all means oppresed and not allowed to do such things as men. But, I find that a bit irritating. Surely if it was the case that they were "Just held back" they would been starting to make great creations by now that live up to what males have made?
I'm very up and forward in attitude about equality. I seen that males weren't getting their equal rights, either but don't have as much people defending that point, in which made me want to be on their side out of fairness.
How would you suggest a man even gets people to notice this? There are many male equality activists that try be civil, even when they go on TV shows for some time to speak about it, it is always filled with a man trying to say what he has to say, but the feminist activist on the show with him always speaking over him so that he can't have his say, in which case only the feminist gets heard. Being quiet isn't helping the male gender, they need to scream to be heard.
(Continue in second comment)
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[Old Memory]
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I agree completely with the original feminists. The new feminism is nothing like the old one. Like I've said to others, today's feminists are mainly for special treatment, under the disguise of equallity.
Yes, there has happened about sex assualts. However. You should know that 80% of sex assualts of women on men don't get taken seriously at all. An example of this would be when two 8th grade girls stripped an eleven year old boy while a third 8th grader girl recorded it. The boy was screaming for them to get off him, shouting for his mother, trying to keep his shorts on and they just kept doing it laughing.
Did these girls get punished even though it was all recorded? No. Guess how a report of the insident got classed as? "Just some girls playing a prank"... We know for a fact that if it was boys the same age doing it to an eleven year old, they would be facing so many charges. So I dissagree with you there. If a recorded sexual harrassment assault doesn't show as evidence, then why do you think men won't admit to being sexually assaulted or attacked by females?
Female sexual harrassment = Prank.
Male sexual harrassment = Rapist.
I listened to a video by "girlwriteswhat" a Youtuber. What she said made sense. She said that men are more likely to focus on their career before anything else, including family. Females however will put family ahead of work, in which would take away time, effort and success due to them nothaving work as their first priority. Is it wrong she puts her family first? No.
By men making work their prioprity before everything else unlike a woman, he is bound to put more effort, more time, and more likely to be successful in his workplace. Which is why he is likely to earn more. If a woman is doing the exact same time, she does get paid for it as much as a male does. It's feminists that have made this whole myth that females natrually get paid less for being female, because males are more likely to make it their number one priority. Also, females can fall pregnant. Falling pregnant involves time off, where as males don't have that problem, which is why they would be picked if their is a female with the samequalifications.
(continue on third comment).
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Women of power and control of couontries such as the queenirritates me. She has done nothing to help Britain, and it gets worse every year. Who are the ones that have to try solve the problems? The males that are lower in power from her.
The prositute one is a bit annoying. Males have always been people to seek out sex, it's in their nature and instinct. If a woman wastold togo against any of her natural instincts, we'dbe called sexist.
It's all fine and dandy to say we all have problems, and if we do, I still believe men have it worse, because females have the support of agencies and the goverment in which men don't have nearly as much support.
Also. The one that commented to you below "nobleserpant", he's a troll. If you reply to him in an intelligent way, he'll just keep attempting to troll. I started replying to him, no matter what he said "You're doing it wrong" and have told people he replies to to do the same, in which they believe it was a good thing to do. You don't need to reply to him, but if you do, simply repeat for every reply he sends"You're doing it wrong" basically saying he's/she's not doing a good job at trolling. It tends to irritate him/her and make them ignore you and not attemp trolling the person repeating it to them again.
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PumpkinKate
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nobleserpent
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The funny thing is, I agree with the vast majority of what you're saying. The story about the boy being assaulted by the two girls? It's awful, wasn't a prank, and is clearly sexual assault. I dislike gender inequality wherever it appears, on either side of the coin.
But I still don't agree with seeing it as black and white and treating it like a war. I just don't see any great possibility of success when you turn the same tactic back against your perpetrators.
To address a few points: Nobody is going to tell you Einstein wasn't smart, but I guarantee you if you picked the top 100 highest IQ people in the world and asked them who was the smartest, they wouldn't all say Einstein. Because it's an opinion still and always. Ghandi? Opinion. Mother Theresa, Joan of Arc, The Oracle at Delphi, Blavatsky, Maya Angelou, Florence Nightingale, Eleanor Roosevelt... all viable opinions, equally arguable.
The bit about assuming a women will do worse at her job because she cares about her family, and she gets paid less? Well, that's called sexism. "He is bound to put..." No. Stop right there. Companies get sued for that sort of thing and with good reason. It's discrimination. Unless they can prove with numbers and raw data that they're correct, which is a very rare occurrence compared to the number of incidents.
There is no myth about females getting paid less than males. It's solid fact, compiled from data that is gathered through legal means from legitimate companies and business practices. It is 100% undeniable fact with concrete empirical data behind it. The bit about them getting pregnant is also called discrimination, and is not a legal business practice. Ever read those posters in the break room at work about discrimination?
There are also plenty of facts I can throw at that twist the truth, just like some of the ones you have. I don't like doing it, but just so you know - the vast majority of rapists are men, the vast majority of serial killers are men, child molesters, criminals, murderers, drug dealers, arsonists, domestic abuse cases, etc. etc. etc.
Now... I personally don't think it's fair to use this, but it's all true. Just goes to show you what "fact" can be used for.
The prostitute thing... I'll concede the point. That can be argued to have more to do with our biological procreative methods as a species. Still, the morality argument could hold a strong candle to that. (continued)
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And then your statement "I still believe men have it worse" well... I don't know how to say it without being rude, and it's not really my intention to belittle you for this viewpoint, but: that's pathetic. I mean, really? Victimization is just so unappealing to me. I hate it when women do it, and I hate it when men do it. 100% honestly? I hate it a little more when men do it because even I am a little bit influenced by the sexist belief that men should have some damn balls and not whine so much.
All in all I like to think that we have a similar goal - gender equality all around. I think we have different ideas on where the current inequality lies, and HOW to get to that equality we seek... but most people will. Maybe it's not that important in the end, if the outcome is the same, I can't really say. Also thank you for the note about the serpent guy, I wasn't sure what to make of him.
You don't irritate but what makes You think I'm trolling?
What evidence do you have?
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blueizbabe07
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You're doing it wrong.
This has nothing to do with anything, but what the hell is trolling?? And btw im getting alot of amusment out of reading this debat. Great points of veiw on both sides.