See, what you're doing here is making assumptions for the ways OTHER people feel. Who are you to say cheating doesn't hurt more to some people than even rape? I'm a PTSD sufferer and being cheated on would hurt me just as much.
Not to mention the misandry in your comment about how you mention MEN who rape and the implication of child abuse, since the media shows men abusing children far more than women. You could have just as easily brought up the fact that many women are cheating and divorcing their husbands with someone else's kids who the husband has to pay for - Never mind the fact that most men lose custody of their child rights to 'domestic violence' which a lot of times is not even the case, but a lie inculcated by the 'victim' who is the perpetrator. You think these men don't suffer for losing custody of their own children over nothing? But you wouldn't be fair because you subconsciously have a distaste for the male gender as society has conditioned you to - yes I know you will disagree, but that's why it's called *subliminal programming*.
Nor will I go into a debate with you over the politics behind it as it will go no where. Just like you stated your Opinion so am I stating mine. You seem to think that your opinion of what's 'worse' is universal, but it isn't.
Are you seriously suggesting that most rape and child sexual abuse isn't committed by men? Please note I am saying MOST, not all.
I do not believe you can compare the painful effects of cheating which happens in a relationship between adults, to the effects of sexual abuse on a child or of the violence of rape on anyone of any age.
I have been through abuse myself and for me PERSONALLY cheating would be far more painful, but I place emphasis on romance more than most people do. Things aren't so black and white.
And yes, there is a lot of propaganda and politics behind what the media claims to be 'truth' versus what is really true. Like I said, this argument with you will go over no where, but I'll point out my opinion just as you have yours in the name of fairness. BeLieve what you want to believe, but I'll say that you're missing the bigger picture here with your assumptions and subjective statements.
You think fathers who lose custody of their children over lies because the court system supports the female even if the husband has committed no crimes is not as painful? Why not be fair when making statements about the subjectivity of emotional pain? Your comments are subconsciously misandrist, and so my comments will seek to balance this out and point out the opposite, which is often times being overlooked.
There is subliminal programming going on everywhere in the media and you're just another victim of it without realizing it. Research the truth about how the media is lying about domestic violence numbers and rape allegations, a lot of which don't truly happen, yet the male gets into trouble and loses his job, family, life... but he's insignificant in your mind. You wouldn't admit it but you are being extremely one sided and misandrist on a subconscious level.
I have been through child sexual abuse, domestic violence, assaults by both male and female lovers and rape by a male, which has resulted in PTSD. I also lost custody of my 5 year old daughter because her father's lies about me were believed by the court so I do know how painful that can be.
I've also worked in the family violence and sexual violence fields since the 70's and it's been very difficult until recently to get the media to take any notice of these issues. My views on these issues are not formed by any subliminal brainwashing by the media but by personal and work experience.
Regarding untrue rape allegations, the man who raped me has been getting away with it in the same community for more than 40 years and has only been charged once and it wasn't proceeded with because he terrified the woman into not giving evidence against him. Most women don't report rape, most cases don't get to court and of those that do, most rapists aren't convicted. Same for child sexual abuse, which is predominantly commmitted by men.
I appreciate the mature way that you responded and am sorry for what you've been through. I can relate to trauma and know how hard it is. I'll admit that me being overly vulnerable to the topic of cheating is an outlier.
You said you had a female lover - have you experienced discrimination for your bisexuality? I ask this because as a bisexual, I often see gays being hated (usually by other males), yet lesbians are often times supported *in comparison*. I'll admit that a lot of this has to do with the fact that males tend to use their testosterone as their moral compass. Nevertheless, it is another topic I have suffered from for over 2 decades - being feminine/bi, from both genders, yet I haven't noticed women having as hard of a time if they had female partners.
In fact, I don't notice males talking about having other male lovers near as much as females do, even online. It saddens me. What's your take on this?
Also, those males/females who abused you shouldn't be considered "lovers". Many people have a skewed perception of "love".
My loss of custody was partly because of "lesbian tendencies" plus involvement in the Women's Liberation Movement. I was evicted from one long term tenancy after the owners realised I had a woman lover.
As to your other point, it's definitely true that gay males have historically experienced more discrimination than lesbians have: in most countries lesbianism was never illegal whereas male homosexual acts were. I suspect very many men don't take lesbianism seriously enough to be upset by it and certainly a lot of men have fantasies of "converting" lesbians to heterosexuality.
I reckon gay males are still more of a threat to heterosexual males than are lesbians, and at the risk of you calling me out on misandry again, it is straight males who have the most power at this point in time.
Point taken to your last sentence, but they were sexual partners at the time, which is why I used the term "lovers". I totally agree with your last sentence!
Very, true. Infidelity is a terrible betrayal, but when it comes to things like rape and any kind of child abuse, especially sexual abuse my hear breaks for the victims. I find myself near speechly, and all I can think or say is, "there but for the grace of God go I".
I hope and pray those victims get the justice they deserve or at least the grace of God to carry on and heal their deep wounds, their trauma.
I've had PTSD from childhood abandonment and being left out in the street, but still view cheating as far worse, but this depends on the Person's emotional character and mentality more than anything else. It's an assumption to think one is 'worse' than the other based on anecdotes or personal experience. I'd rather die than be cheated on. Heck, the rampancy of cheating everywhere causes more pain to me (and I haven't been in a relationship to be cheated on) more than bipolar/ptsd/aspergers most of the time. But then I value romance, which I understand not many people do.
I'm those awful things happened to you, and I wish I had something more helpful and constructive to say.
I hate when people act like cheating isn't a big deal, but I think there are people who have thought of cheating that way since the dawn of time. I personally see cheating as a grave betrayal. I honestly think that a person who cheats on his or her husband or wife is someone of poor character who's not worthy of trust. People make all sorts of excuses for cheating, but as far as I'm concerned it boils down to a lack of commitment and a lack of courage. I figure a person can either stay committed then work to repair and improve the relationship or if the differences are irreconcilable then the person can leave the relationship and have the courage to be alone. Many people are weak, selfish and greedy; they want to have their cake and eat it too.
I totally agree. Didn't mean to come across as rude with the way I responded btw. This topic just irks me to the point of creating physical symptoms and most people don't seem to fathom how anyone could feel so hurt, as many people these daze only seem to want sex without love, when the two are hand in glove to me and always have been. Ever since I was a child 6-7 I wanted romance, but the way people view sex these daze has completely ruined coitus for me.
I suffer everyday because of this and it just doesn't feel natural to me; I know this within my heart no matter how many people are conditioned to think it's not 'normal'. Normalcy doesn't equate to the reality for some of us!
Cheating is a bigger deal to me and person A than with person B. Just the same as with swinging or polygamy; I'm not against it but what I don't like to hear is people claiming that desiring a monogamous relationship is 'unnatural' without knowing me or others who desire it, let alone those who have lived it for 80+ years in bliss without a single thought of having other partners. People read a mainstream article (from jezebell or other commercial sites) and seem to think whatever that's written is set in stone and 'scientific', when even the science is monopolized to suite the needs of bankers... long story.
I think monogamy is totally natural! It doesn't always work out of course, but I think betrayal is so selfish, and cowardly compared to just being honest and admitting that the relationship isn't working. I do envy people who get to marry their high school or college sweetheart, and then go on to spend their lives together! It seems those people with many decades of blissful monogamy under their proverbial belts have an advantage over the majority of us who are less fortunate, because they seem to live longer, healier, more productive and more successful lives.
I myself have been accused of being a serial monogamist, and I can't deny it's true, but it's not because monogamy is a faulty institution, but rather because I myself have made poor choices in my life by virtue of my own lack of adequate moral and spiritual formation as well as a lack of guidance on the part of my parents. I love my parents very much, but do have my share of resentments against them. I think they did the best they could, but that their so called guidance tended to manifest itself more so in my mother's strict and sheltering ways and my father's passive aggressive editorializing of television, news, current events and pop culture when what I really needed were much more direct, heart to heart, objective, loving and non-shaming open communication.
Well I have to live through other lives because I don't even know what it's like to hold anyone's hand in 28 years and probably until this body's 6 feet under (can't wait). So in lieu of envy I feel relieved to see that there are those out there that actually give a fuck about one another. Just look at some of the comments down where I was responding; people don't know anything about love. People get married for all the wrong reasons and when they get into fights that's considered 'love' nowadays. People love their pets more than their so called 'lovers'. hah "lovers" what a joke that word is. Dogs these days get more love than some people honestly. Its' so sad how low the human race has fallen; not that they were ever really civilized about love anyway.
Think of it this way: at least you had someone in your life even though the relationship wasn't the way you imagined it should be. I was a romantic ever since I was 6-7 and all I ever saw was hatred and shallowness. When they do marry its almost always about superficial reasons that have nothing to do with love, yet they ignorantly think that's love and proceed to call their co-habitant slaves their "lovers". What a joke. And people get surprised when there are those like the OP who get so upset over cheating or disloyalty. These people were spoon fed all their lives and know nothing about heart break and loneliness. They treat their dogs better than their own partners, so why marry? Marriage is a joke that profits the bankers and has naught to do with love or even friendship. What's friendship let alone companionship when you throw your husband/wife out of bed for your pet dog cause its more important to you? Why get married then you morons?
I don't stand for that shit which is why I'm alone and would rather die alone. The more I read comments by fools who don't know anything about love the more depressing it gets. It's why I don't watch television anymore cause it's all about cheating and shallowness crammed down peoples' throats , and I'm gonna end up eventually abandoning the internet as well. Toxic waste is better left in the garbage disposal than to waste our time with. If I was ever with someone then I better be their #1 or it's just not worth it for me. I better be loved for who I am and seen as the most attractive to that particular person, as they would to me.
If you're with the right partner attraction+love would fit like a puzzle, creating a beautiful picture of love. Unfortunately most people dont' expect anything except sex or money or stupid superficiality that bores me because there is so much more out of life, and yet it's so difficult to go on with life when your'e constantly alone and have 'love' (which is really nothing close to love) crammed down your throat everywhere you go. Dogs even have human lovers yet some of us are doomed to suffer alone for nothing.
IIN That i want to kill women who cheat on their boyfriend/husband?
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There is no hell except the one you're creating for yourself with all this pointless resentment and hatred
I can think of LOTS worse betrayals than infidelity: how about men who rape partners who trust them or sexually abuse children?
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RoseIsabella
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True.
See, what you're doing here is making assumptions for the ways OTHER people feel. Who are you to say cheating doesn't hurt more to some people than even rape? I'm a PTSD sufferer and being cheated on would hurt me just as much.
Not to mention the misandry in your comment about how you mention MEN who rape and the implication of child abuse, since the media shows men abusing children far more than women. You could have just as easily brought up the fact that many women are cheating and divorcing their husbands with someone else's kids who the husband has to pay for - Never mind the fact that most men lose custody of their child rights to 'domestic violence' which a lot of times is not even the case, but a lie inculcated by the 'victim' who is the perpetrator. You think these men don't suffer for losing custody of their own children over nothing? But you wouldn't be fair because you subconsciously have a distaste for the male gender as society has conditioned you to - yes I know you will disagree, but that's why it's called *subliminal programming*.
Nor will I go into a debate with you over the politics behind it as it will go no where. Just like you stated your Opinion so am I stating mine. You seem to think that your opinion of what's 'worse' is universal, but it isn't.
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Are you seriously suggesting that most rape and child sexual abuse isn't committed by men? Please note I am saying MOST, not all.
I do not believe you can compare the painful effects of cheating which happens in a relationship between adults, to the effects of sexual abuse on a child or of the violence of rape on anyone of any age.
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I have been through abuse myself and for me PERSONALLY cheating would be far more painful, but I place emphasis on romance more than most people do. Things aren't so black and white.
And yes, there is a lot of propaganda and politics behind what the media claims to be 'truth' versus what is really true. Like I said, this argument with you will go over no where, but I'll point out my opinion just as you have yours in the name of fairness. BeLieve what you want to believe, but I'll say that you're missing the bigger picture here with your assumptions and subjective statements.
You think fathers who lose custody of their children over lies because the court system supports the female even if the husband has committed no crimes is not as painful? Why not be fair when making statements about the subjectivity of emotional pain? Your comments are subconsciously misandrist, and so my comments will seek to balance this out and point out the opposite, which is often times being overlooked.
There is subliminal programming going on everywhere in the media and you're just another victim of it without realizing it. Research the truth about how the media is lying about domestic violence numbers and rape allegations, a lot of which don't truly happen, yet the male gets into trouble and loses his job, family, life... but he's insignificant in your mind. You wouldn't admit it but you are being extremely one sided and misandrist on a subconscious level.
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I have been through child sexual abuse, domestic violence, assaults by both male and female lovers and rape by a male, which has resulted in PTSD. I also lost custody of my 5 year old daughter because her father's lies about me were believed by the court so I do know how painful that can be.
I've also worked in the family violence and sexual violence fields since the 70's and it's been very difficult until recently to get the media to take any notice of these issues. My views on these issues are not formed by any subliminal brainwashing by the media but by personal and work experience.
Regarding untrue rape allegations, the man who raped me has been getting away with it in the same community for more than 40 years and has only been charged once and it wasn't proceeded with because he terrified the woman into not giving evidence against him. Most women don't report rape, most cases don't get to court and of those that do, most rapists aren't convicted. Same for child sexual abuse, which is predominantly commmitted by men.
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I appreciate the mature way that you responded and am sorry for what you've been through. I can relate to trauma and know how hard it is. I'll admit that me being overly vulnerable to the topic of cheating is an outlier.
You said you had a female lover - have you experienced discrimination for your bisexuality? I ask this because as a bisexual, I often see gays being hated (usually by other males), yet lesbians are often times supported *in comparison*. I'll admit that a lot of this has to do with the fact that males tend to use their testosterone as their moral compass. Nevertheless, it is another topic I have suffered from for over 2 decades - being feminine/bi, from both genders, yet I haven't noticed women having as hard of a time if they had female partners.
In fact, I don't notice males talking about having other male lovers near as much as females do, even online. It saddens me. What's your take on this?
Also, those males/females who abused you shouldn't be considered "lovers". Many people have a skewed perception of "love".
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My loss of custody was partly because of "lesbian tendencies" plus involvement in the Women's Liberation Movement. I was evicted from one long term tenancy after the owners realised I had a woman lover.
As to your other point, it's definitely true that gay males have historically experienced more discrimination than lesbians have: in most countries lesbianism was never illegal whereas male homosexual acts were. I suspect very many men don't take lesbianism seriously enough to be upset by it and certainly a lot of men have fantasies of "converting" lesbians to heterosexuality.
I reckon gay males are still more of a threat to heterosexual males than are lesbians, and at the risk of you calling me out on misandry again, it is straight males who have the most power at this point in time.
Point taken to your last sentence, but they were sexual partners at the time, which is why I used the term "lovers". I totally agree with your last sentence!
Very, true. Infidelity is a terrible betrayal, but when it comes to things like rape and any kind of child abuse, especially sexual abuse my hear breaks for the victims. I find myself near speechly, and all I can think or say is, "there but for the grace of God go I".
I hope and pray those victims get the justice they deserve or at least the grace of God to carry on and heal their deep wounds, their trauma.
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NYXX
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I've had PTSD from childhood abandonment and being left out in the street, but still view cheating as far worse, but this depends on the Person's emotional character and mentality more than anything else. It's an assumption to think one is 'worse' than the other based on anecdotes or personal experience. I'd rather die than be cheated on. Heck, the rampancy of cheating everywhere causes more pain to me (and I haven't been in a relationship to be cheated on) more than bipolar/ptsd/aspergers most of the time. But then I value romance, which I understand not many people do.
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I'm those awful things happened to you, and I wish I had something more helpful and constructive to say.
I hate when people act like cheating isn't a big deal, but I think there are people who have thought of cheating that way since the dawn of time. I personally see cheating as a grave betrayal. I honestly think that a person who cheats on his or her husband or wife is someone of poor character who's not worthy of trust. People make all sorts of excuses for cheating, but as far as I'm concerned it boils down to a lack of commitment and a lack of courage. I figure a person can either stay committed then work to repair and improve the relationship or if the differences are irreconcilable then the person can leave the relationship and have the courage to be alone. Many people are weak, selfish and greedy; they want to have their cake and eat it too.
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I totally agree. Didn't mean to come across as rude with the way I responded btw. This topic just irks me to the point of creating physical symptoms and most people don't seem to fathom how anyone could feel so hurt, as many people these daze only seem to want sex without love, when the two are hand in glove to me and always have been. Ever since I was a child 6-7 I wanted romance, but the way people view sex these daze has completely ruined coitus for me.
I suffer everyday because of this and it just doesn't feel natural to me; I know this within my heart no matter how many people are conditioned to think it's not 'normal'. Normalcy doesn't equate to the reality for some of us!
Cheating is a bigger deal to me and person A than with person B. Just the same as with swinging or polygamy; I'm not against it but what I don't like to hear is people claiming that desiring a monogamous relationship is 'unnatural' without knowing me or others who desire it, let alone those who have lived it for 80+ years in bliss without a single thought of having other partners. People read a mainstream article (from jezebell or other commercial sites) and seem to think whatever that's written is set in stone and 'scientific', when even the science is monopolized to suite the needs of bankers... long story.
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RoseIsabella
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I think monogamy is totally natural! It doesn't always work out of course, but I think betrayal is so selfish, and cowardly compared to just being honest and admitting that the relationship isn't working. I do envy people who get to marry their high school or college sweetheart, and then go on to spend their lives together! It seems those people with many decades of blissful monogamy under their proverbial belts have an advantage over the majority of us who are less fortunate, because they seem to live longer, healier, more productive and more successful lives.
I myself have been accused of being a serial monogamist, and I can't deny it's true, but it's not because monogamy is a faulty institution, but rather because I myself have made poor choices in my life by virtue of my own lack of adequate moral and spiritual formation as well as a lack of guidance on the part of my parents. I love my parents very much, but do have my share of resentments against them. I think they did the best they could, but that their so called guidance tended to manifest itself more so in my mother's strict and sheltering ways and my father's passive aggressive editorializing of television, news, current events and pop culture when what I really needed were much more direct, heart to heart, objective, loving and non-shaming open communication.
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NYXX
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Well I have to live through other lives because I don't even know what it's like to hold anyone's hand in 28 years and probably until this body's 6 feet under (can't wait). So in lieu of envy I feel relieved to see that there are those out there that actually give a fuck about one another. Just look at some of the comments down where I was responding; people don't know anything about love. People get married for all the wrong reasons and when they get into fights that's considered 'love' nowadays. People love their pets more than their so called 'lovers'. hah "lovers" what a joke that word is. Dogs these days get more love than some people honestly. Its' so sad how low the human race has fallen; not that they were ever really civilized about love anyway.
Think of it this way: at least you had someone in your life even though the relationship wasn't the way you imagined it should be. I was a romantic ever since I was 6-7 and all I ever saw was hatred and shallowness. When they do marry its almost always about superficial reasons that have nothing to do with love, yet they ignorantly think that's love and proceed to call their co-habitant slaves their "lovers". What a joke. And people get surprised when there are those like the OP who get so upset over cheating or disloyalty. These people were spoon fed all their lives and know nothing about heart break and loneliness. They treat their dogs better than their own partners, so why marry? Marriage is a joke that profits the bankers and has naught to do with love or even friendship. What's friendship let alone companionship when you throw your husband/wife out of bed for your pet dog cause its more important to you? Why get married then you morons?
I don't stand for that shit which is why I'm alone and would rather die alone. The more I read comments by fools who don't know anything about love the more depressing it gets. It's why I don't watch television anymore cause it's all about cheating and shallowness crammed down peoples' throats , and I'm gonna end up eventually abandoning the internet as well. Toxic waste is better left in the garbage disposal than to waste our time with. If I was ever with someone then I better be their #1 or it's just not worth it for me. I better be loved for who I am and seen as the most attractive to that particular person, as they would to me.
If you're with the right partner attraction+love would fit like a puzzle, creating a beautiful picture of love. Unfortunately most people dont' expect anything except sex or money or stupid superficiality that bores me because there is so much more out of life, and yet it's so difficult to go on with life when your'e constantly alone and have 'love' (which is really nothing close to love) crammed down your throat everywhere you go. Dogs even have human lovers yet some of us are doomed to suffer alone for nothing.