To me their are some MAJOR flaws in religion. Flaws that can't be disputed.
Religions main argument is that god must have existed to create the universe because somthing cant come from nothing.
The obvious question is who created god? Saying he always existed is a cop out, the idea of god creating the universe leaves us with the same questions as we had in the first place.
Why did god make the universe so big? I mean, he wasnt exactly efficent with the space was he? Does it not seem alot more likely that out of the billions and billions of planets ours just happens to be in the right location for life to exist? The religious argument of "look how perfectly everything had to be for us to be here" doesnt stand when you consider the size of the universe.
Then their is the bible... as the op states, bassicly its full of shit and i have read it several times. I often wonder how many people are christian because of the fear of hell, i was once a christian for the same reason. After noticing many flaws it allowed me to think for myself about the bible, instead of being scared to for the fear of hell.
What about the people in the world who were not brought up on christianity. Do they go to hell because they were born in the wrong place??
Or how about all the pain and misery in the world?
Oh yea, god just left us to it didnt he, i forgot.
Dont get me started on the christians who say without god their are no morals. Morals are bread into us, i dont kill because i know its wrong, not because i fear hell in the afterlife.
Religion makes up an answer for every question we throw at it because it's people are blinded by faith.
PS id love to hear a christians argument for my questions raised :D
You are misguided. I beleive that each person gets handled differently in judgement (due to the factors they can't control in their lives), and that reincarnation is an option.
How did God get here? If you dont like the "always been here" idea, then the best explanation would be he somehow created himself. We may never know.
The church today has its flaws, as do all religions. Its our job to find the truth mixed in the lies.
No that is not the 1st use of the term. Look it up, that is what popular usage has turn it into. It was 1st just an admission of guilt. Why are you so angry all the time? I was just to teach you something.
I love when someone attempts to make an argument but directly indicates their lack of education by saying things like what you just stated. I wouldnt entertain him.
Romans 4:15 because the law brings about wrath; for where there is no law there is no transgression. (without law, how do we know what is right, if there is no speed limit, how will I know what is too fast or too slow)
Job 26:7 - HE STRETCHES OUT THE NORTH OVER EMPTY SPACE; HE HANGS THE EARTH ON NOTHING.
(How else could they know about space and the Earth, and how it floats in the solar system, except for there being an all knowing God!)
Genesis 18:25 - Far be it from You to do such a thing as this, to slay the righteous with the wicked, so that the righteous should be as the wicked; far be it from You! Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?” (God will judge each of us justly)
Leviticus 26:(27-30) - 27 ‘And after all this, if you do not obey Me, but walk contrary to Me,
28 then I also will walk contrary to you in fury;
and I, even I, will chastise you seven times for your sins.
29 You shall eat the flesh of your sons, and you shall eat the flesh of your daughters.
30 I will destroy your high places, cut down your incense altars, and cast your carcasses on the lifeless forms of your idols;
and My soul shall abhor you.
(37-42)37 They shall stumble over one another, as it were before a sword, when no one pursues;
and you shall have no power to stand before your enemies.
38 You shall perish among the nations, and the land of your enemies shall eat you up.
39 And those of you who are left shall waste away in their iniquity in your enemies’ lands;
also in their fathers’ iniquities, which are with them, they shall waste away.
40 ‘But if they confess their iniquity and the iniquity of their fathers, with their unfaithfulness in which they were unfaithful to Me, and that they also have walked contrary to Me,
41 and that I also have walked contrary to them and have brought them into the land of their enemies;
if their uncircumcised hearts are humbled, and they accept their guilt—
42 then I will remember My covenant with Jacob, and My covenant with Isaac and My covenant with Abraham I will remember;
I will remember the land.
(There are cursed nations/lands, because of Idolatry, and those who turned away from God)
Romans 5:(18-19)18 Therefore, as through one man’s(Adam) offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s(Jesus) righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life. 19 For as by one man’s(Adam) disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s(Jesus) obedience many will be made righteous.
(It's about eternal life. He didn't say we wouldn't have pain or suffering on Earth, but he did promise us eternal life if we believe in and Love Him. The world was made imperfect by sin, it will only be paradise when we get to Heaven)
TAKE YOUR CHANCES IF YOU WANT TO. IT WON'T HURT YOU TO FOLLOW THE LAWS, THEY TEACH GOOD THINGS. HEIR ON THE SIDE OF CAUTION.... =)
His answers are my answers! Duh, what you want me to make up stuff? The answers are there, so I gave them to you. I even took my time to find the ones that were the most plain, so you could understand completely, and you still won't receive it, but it's okay. And "typical religious" is not what God is. And God is not logical, that's why he tells us not to lean or our own understanding, but to trust in him!!
Proverbs 3:5
New King James Version (NKJV)
5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart,
And lean not on your own understanding;
Too bad that when you become religious, or are "born"/"born again", YOU are conforming YOUR own opinion to a preexisting, rigid doctrine. You create all authorities you accept. You make God in your own image.
Did you not mean, "Err on the sde of caution"?
If everyone erred on the side of caution, that would mean that no one would ever take any risks. If no one ever took any risks, then that would lead to stagnation in the development of our civilisation.
and yea err, that's what I meant. and people wouldn't be "perfect", because we will still fall short, we know that. So I'm sure someone will give us something to pray about.
You have used a word that descibes a habitual ceremonial practice. They regard this as an insult to them, and an insult to yourself. They recommend quiet contemplation at an appropriate time and place, instead. They frown on habitual ceremonial practices.
I am going to try to explain this to you (I hope for the last time), so that people stop spreading these fanciful concepts to future generations of people. The word you used above in your comment, usually refers to a subterranean nether world where bad people go when they die, and the opposite, a region in space where one or more deities exist and where supposedly good people go when they die.
Ancient people knew very little about our natural Universe. It is ironic, that some of the more Enlightened people in the Ancient Hellenic civilisation knew that the Earth was a sphere (they had measured this to some degree of accuracy) and that the solar system was heliocentric. Later people, who knew very little about the natural Universe, these being the 'followers' of Jesus of Nazareth, adopted old ideas from earlier Mesopotamian civilisation. They imagined that the Earth was flat, and that the solar system was geocentric. They imagined that when a person dies, if they are bad, they go down, if they are good, they go up among the stars. We now know much more about the structure of Earth and the properties of space. Let's suppose that this 'bad' place actually exists in the molten part of the mantle of Earth's crust. We also now know that outer space and most planets are hostile environments, few planets capable of supporting life, and fewer still capable of supporting human life.
Please consider the following seriously:
Let's suppose that there is a hypothetical Earth-like planet in orbit around a nearby Sun-like star like Vega. You build a spaceship, and travel to this other planet. Now you stand on the surface of the planet, and look out into space at night, towards Sol (our Sun). Is planet Earth now not in the 'good' place? What about the 'bad' place? Is it now in with the 'good' place, or did it move because you did, and is now beneath the surface of the other planet?
There can be only two other possibilities. Some type of parallel Universe, but this is impossible. Why? If it were an antimatter Universe, it would annihilate ordinary matter, and thus you. If it were an ordinary matter Universe, it would be part of our Universe.
The only other option left, is an Exo-Universe. I would be willing to discuss this with you, IF you promise to keep an open mind AND you try to stop spreading these old outdated ideas and concepts around.
The terms up and down, Hell and Heaven, above and below are somewhat figurative. Besides, Heaven is outside our universe, so that's still somewhat correct. As for Hell, down means to be low, and to be low is a bit symbolic for being wretched or evil. Besides, the Bible was written by man (though most readings usually orginated from what Jesus said). It is subject to flaw.
I disagree. The terms up and down are relative directions. No absolute direction corresponds to any of the relative directions. This is a consequence of the translational invariance of the laws of physics: nature, loosely speaking, behaves the same no matter what direction one moves. The terms above and below are relative positions. Direction is the information contained in the relative position of one point with respect to another point without the distance information. Because of this, none of these exist in nature, unless we agree on an absolute frame of reference.
The other two terms that you mentioned, which I care not to repeat (thus creating division in society), are purely abstract concepts (fantasy) that do not exist in this Universe or any other Universe, except in the minds and media of some of the people of the specie Homo sapiens sapiens. I have 'inside' information of this.
IIN I think people who believe the Bible is the word of God are...
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I agree with everything the op wrote.
To me their are some MAJOR flaws in religion. Flaws that can't be disputed.
Religions main argument is that god must have existed to create the universe because somthing cant come from nothing.
The obvious question is who created god? Saying he always existed is a cop out, the idea of god creating the universe leaves us with the same questions as we had in the first place.
Why did god make the universe so big? I mean, he wasnt exactly efficent with the space was he? Does it not seem alot more likely that out of the billions and billions of planets ours just happens to be in the right location for life to exist? The religious argument of "look how perfectly everything had to be for us to be here" doesnt stand when you consider the size of the universe.
Then their is the bible... as the op states, bassicly its full of shit and i have read it several times. I often wonder how many people are christian because of the fear of hell, i was once a christian for the same reason. After noticing many flaws it allowed me to think for myself about the bible, instead of being scared to for the fear of hell.
What about the people in the world who were not brought up on christianity. Do they go to hell because they were born in the wrong place??
Or how about all the pain and misery in the world?
Oh yea, god just left us to it didnt he, i forgot.
Dont get me started on the christians who say without god their are no morals. Morals are bread into us, i dont kill because i know its wrong, not because i fear hell in the afterlife.
Religion makes up an answer for every question we throw at it because it's people are blinded by faith.
PS id love to hear a christians argument for my questions raised :D
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SamuraiGallade
11 years ago
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[Old Memory]
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nobleserpent
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pyt_1185
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You are misguided. I beleive that each person gets handled differently in judgement (due to the factors they can't control in their lives), and that reincarnation is an option.
How did God get here? If you dont like the "always been here" idea, then the best explanation would be he somehow created himself. We may never know.
The church today has its flaws, as do all religions. Its our job to find the truth mixed in the lies.
A cop out is an admission of guilt not an excuse, not even a poor one.
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nowhereboy
11 years ago
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anti-hero
11 years ago
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Just for the record you're wrong.
"cop out - refers to taking the easy way out of a sticky situation"
Next time you're going to try and make me look like a dick head atleast get your facts right.
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[Old Memory]
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No that is not the 1st use of the term. Look it up, that is what popular usage has turn it into. It was 1st just an admission of guilt. Why are you so angry all the time? I was just to teach you something.
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nowhereboy
11 years ago
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Im angry because im being hated on for no reason what so ever.
Instead of people arguing with my ideas or concepts people instead choose to correct my grammer or look for faults in my words.
Re-read this thread, i have not had ONE reply regarding the topic i wrote about.
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[Old Memory]
11 years ago
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I can see your point but I wasn't trying to be an asshole about it, I was just trying to inform. I apologize if I came off badly.
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nowhereboy
11 years ago
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No worries dude, alongside everything else being said i mistook your comment for an insult.
He is too stupid to have a come back for you.
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nowhereboy
11 years ago
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Are you serious kid?
He didn't even present me with an argument. Why would i bother wasting my time replying?
You're really starting to get on my tits.
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anti-hero
11 years ago
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[Old Memory]
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You are a boy with tits? That is kind of freaky. He/She did make an argument, are you retarded?
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nowhereboy
11 years ago
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Your really dragging this out now like, what argument did he present?
That a cop out is an admission of guilt?
Not much of an argument, especially saying as its wrong.
Why have you decided to hate on me for no reason?
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anti-hero
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I don't hate you, I just like debating. Nobody is forcing you to reply. Feel free not to answer and I will leave you alone.
He/She is right about the cop out thing though, look it up.
Cheers.
I did present an argument.
"Morals are bread into us, I don't kill because I know"
"Morals are bread into us, I don't"
"Morals are bread into us"
"Morals are bread"
"Bread"
Morality is a bread now? Is it a tasty bread?
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SharP
11 years ago
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I love when someone attempts to make an argument but directly indicates their lack of education by saying things like what you just stated. I wouldnt entertain him.
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uPSIDEOFDOWn
11 years ago
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I think its plain silly that grammar is judged or disputed, ever, unless a message is completely incoherent. You got the point, man. Contemplate it.
I love the smell of morals fresh out the oven.
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nowhereboy
11 years ago
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Yawn.
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[Old Memory]
11 years ago
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Great reply.
Humour fail? Thanks for the irrelevant post fella.
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[Old Memory]
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Isn't your reply just as irrelevant fella?
First of all it's bred, not bread!
Romans 4:15 because the law brings about wrath; for where there is no law there is no transgression. (without law, how do we know what is right, if there is no speed limit, how will I know what is too fast or too slow)
Job 26:7 - HE STRETCHES OUT THE NORTH OVER EMPTY SPACE; HE HANGS THE EARTH ON NOTHING.
(How else could they know about space and the Earth, and how it floats in the solar system, except for there being an all knowing God!)
Genesis 18:25 - Far be it from You to do such a thing as this, to slay the righteous with the wicked, so that the righteous should be as the wicked; far be it from You! Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?” (God will judge each of us justly)
Leviticus 26:(27-30) - 27 ‘And after all this, if you do not obey Me, but walk contrary to Me,
28 then I also will walk contrary to you in fury;
and I, even I, will chastise you seven times for your sins.
29 You shall eat the flesh of your sons, and you shall eat the flesh of your daughters.
30 I will destroy your high places, cut down your incense altars, and cast your carcasses on the lifeless forms of your idols;
and My soul shall abhor you.
(37-42)37 They shall stumble over one another, as it were before a sword, when no one pursues;
and you shall have no power to stand before your enemies.
38 You shall perish among the nations, and the land of your enemies shall eat you up.
39 And those of you who are left shall waste away in their iniquity in your enemies’ lands;
also in their fathers’ iniquities, which are with them, they shall waste away.
40 ‘But if they confess their iniquity and the iniquity of their fathers, with their unfaithfulness in which they were unfaithful to Me, and that they also have walked contrary to Me,
41 and that I also have walked contrary to them and have brought them into the land of their enemies;
if their uncircumcised hearts are humbled, and they accept their guilt—
42 then I will remember My covenant with Jacob, and My covenant with Isaac and My covenant with Abraham I will remember;
I will remember the land.
(There are cursed nations/lands, because of Idolatry, and those who turned away from God)
Romans 5:(18-19)18 Therefore, as through one man’s(Adam) offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s(Jesus) righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life. 19 For as by one man’s(Adam) disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s(Jesus) obedience many will be made righteous.
(It's about eternal life. He didn't say we wouldn't have pain or suffering on Earth, but he did promise us eternal life if we believe in and Love Him. The world was made imperfect by sin, it will only be paradise when we get to Heaven)
TAKE YOUR CHANCES IF YOU WANT TO. IT WON'T HURT YOU TO FOLLOW THE LAWS, THEY TEACH GOOD THINGS. HEIR ON THE SIDE OF CAUTION.... =)
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nowhereboy
11 years ago
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suckonthis9
11 years ago
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Typical religious reply.
Lots of quotes from a man written book and no logical answers to my questions.
Im not even going to waste my time with you.
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anti-hero
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pyt_1185
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Im not even going to waste my time with you.
Translation: You have no come back.
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nowhereboy
11 years ago
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Fuck you parrish.
No come back? The kid replied quoting the bible as "proof"
Hence why i am not wasting my time or intellect.
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anti-hero
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Sure whatever, if you are not smart enough to reply just admit it.
Nowhereboy's intellect = an oxymoron.
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nowhereboy
11 years ago
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If you're going to flame everything i post expect an argument every time.
How can i reply to somthing that doesn't bring up an argument or ask any questions?
It's not complicated parrish.
His answers are my answers! Duh, what you want me to make up stuff? The answers are there, so I gave them to you. I even took my time to find the ones that were the most plain, so you could understand completely, and you still won't receive it, but it's okay. And "typical religious" is not what God is. And God is not logical, that's why he tells us not to lean or our own understanding, but to trust in him!!
Proverbs 3:5
New King James Version (NKJV)
5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart,
And lean not on your own understanding;
--
nowhereboy
11 years ago
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uPSIDEOFDOWn
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Im sorry but i want real answers, i want proof. Why should i base my entire life on "faith"?
I appriciate that you took the time to find relevant quotes but they are irrelivant to me because i dont belive the bible is the word of god.
Too bad that when you become religious, or are "born"/"born again", YOU are conforming YOUR own opinion to a preexisting, rigid doctrine. You create all authorities you accept. You make God in your own image.
Did you not mean, "Err on the sde of caution"?
If everyone erred on the side of caution, that would mean that no one would ever take any risks. If no one ever took any risks, then that would lead to stagnation in the development of our civilisation.
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pyt_1185
11 years ago
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pyt_1185
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and yea err, that's what I meant. and people wouldn't be "perfect", because we will still fall short, we know that. So I'm sure someone will give us something to pray about.
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suckonthis9
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You have used a word that descibes a habitual ceremonial practice. They regard this as an insult to them, and an insult to yourself. They recommend quiet contemplation at an appropriate time and place, instead. They frown on habitual ceremonial practices.
No, it would mean that in your case, if you were wrong, you wouldn't go to hell =)
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suckonthis9
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I am going to try to explain this to you (I hope for the last time), so that people stop spreading these fanciful concepts to future generations of people. The word you used above in your comment, usually refers to a subterranean nether world where bad people go when they die, and the opposite, a region in space where one or more deities exist and where supposedly good people go when they die.
Ancient people knew very little about our natural Universe. It is ironic, that some of the more Enlightened people in the Ancient Hellenic civilisation knew that the Earth was a sphere (they had measured this to some degree of accuracy) and that the solar system was heliocentric. Later people, who knew very little about the natural Universe, these being the 'followers' of Jesus of Nazareth, adopted old ideas from earlier Mesopotamian civilisation. They imagined that the Earth was flat, and that the solar system was geocentric. They imagined that when a person dies, if they are bad, they go down, if they are good, they go up among the stars. We now know much more about the structure of Earth and the properties of space. Let's suppose that this 'bad' place actually exists in the molten part of the mantle of Earth's crust. We also now know that outer space and most planets are hostile environments, few planets capable of supporting life, and fewer still capable of supporting human life.
Please consider the following seriously:
Let's suppose that there is a hypothetical Earth-like planet in orbit around a nearby Sun-like star like Vega. You build a spaceship, and travel to this other planet. Now you stand on the surface of the planet, and look out into space at night, towards Sol (our Sun). Is planet Earth now not in the 'good' place? What about the 'bad' place? Is it now in with the 'good' place, or did it move because you did, and is now beneath the surface of the other planet?
There can be only two other possibilities. Some type of parallel Universe, but this is impossible. Why? If it were an antimatter Universe, it would annihilate ordinary matter, and thus you. If it were an ordinary matter Universe, it would be part of our Universe.
The only other option left, is an Exo-Universe. I would be willing to discuss this with you, IF you promise to keep an open mind AND you try to stop spreading these old outdated ideas and concepts around.
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SamuraiGallade
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uPSIDEOFDOWn
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The terms up and down, Hell and Heaven, above and below are somewhat figurative. Besides, Heaven is outside our universe, so that's still somewhat correct. As for Hell, down means to be low, and to be low is a bit symbolic for being wretched or evil. Besides, the Bible was written by man (though most readings usually orginated from what Jesus said). It is subject to flaw.
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suckonthis9
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I disagree. The terms up and down are relative directions. No absolute direction corresponds to any of the relative directions. This is a consequence of the translational invariance of the laws of physics: nature, loosely speaking, behaves the same no matter what direction one moves. The terms above and below are relative positions. Direction is the information contained in the relative position of one point with respect to another point without the distance information. Because of this, none of these exist in nature, unless we agree on an absolute frame of reference.
The other two terms that you mentioned, which I care not to repeat (thus creating division in society), are purely abstract concepts (fantasy) that do not exist in this Universe or any other Universe, except in the minds and media of some of the people of the specie Homo sapiens sapiens. I have 'inside' information of this.
i have such a nerd-crush on you <333333